Episode 18 Podcast Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):

Don’t overcomplicate the sales or business development process. It’s just a hell of a lot easier than you think. Hi everyone. Rob Kropp here and welcome back to another episode of the Trade Den. How are you Dan? Good to have you back.

Speaker 2 (00:19):

Yeah, good to be back, Rob. Great to be back actually on this second part of a three part series that we’re doing. I’m excited for this. It feels like we hit a bit of a chord on the first one with what we talked about, so looking forward to expanding on some ideas.

Speaker 1 (00:33):

In the previous episode we spoke a lot about the importance of pipeline management and more importantly, we introduced this whole sales bullseye concept, which I really love. I love that whole sales bullseye concept is what it’s really designed to do is help you focus your resources, which is your time and energy and money in the right areas to be able to generate new sales, which is super topical at the moment because if you’re listening to this today, I bet you are no doubt feeling some challenges going on in the marketplace where sales are dipping or pipeline might be drying up. It’s definitely a topical issue at the moment, isn’t it?

Speaker 2 (01:17):

Is I think it’s also as topical as it is at the time we’re recording this. I think this is a skill that we’re going to try and teach and give the listeners today something that they can walk away with that’s going to help ’em and not only when times are a bit tight and a bit tough, but also just moving forward. How do you think about this and how can you be strategic about something as important as making sure you’ve got a full pipeline?

Speaker 1 (01:38):

Yeah, correct. And that’s why I like the sales bullseye as a concept because it’s enduring regardless if you’re in buoyant times or in tight times in a bit of a trough in the marketplace, the concept is enduring because what it helps you do is understand where you are in that bullseye and obviously we spoke around in the last episode as you always start from the centre of the bullseye and work yourself, work your way out, the earlier rings and the bullseye helps you grab all those opportunities in front of you and all that low hanging fruit in terms of all the opportunities that are sitting there in front of you. But every business owner faces that predicament at some time in their journey where they exhaust all those opportunities and they think, well, what’s next? I want to be able to keep growing my business and expanding, and that means at some point in time you have to get on the front foot from a business development point of view and expand into new markets, new relationships, new opportunities rather than just resting on your laurels of the existing opportunities or relationships that you already have at the moment.

(02:46):

So if you’re in that position where your pipeline is either drying up or you’re looking to proactively expand your customer base so you can take your business to the next level, then this episode is absolutely for you.

Speaker 2 (03:01):

It really is. Before we get into it, let’s just be clear. Today’s episode when we’re talking, we’re going to be talking a lot around what we call B2B or business to business sales. So for example, your primary customers, you’re a trading, your primary customers are a builder, a developer, you deal with strata or a building manager, things like that. So B2B is probably where we focus and as a business that’s what we do and predominantly coach is business owners that are in that space. But if you are listening to this today, it’s also going to be relevant if you are B2C. So that space, if you are building out your, you need to build out your industry network with a view of building new future referrals and having those people available to you. You’d be looking in your B2C world as a, let’s use the example of a landscaper you’d be looking at expanding that network into, you’d be looking at building relationships with designers, for instance nurseries, people that can refer ongoing work to you. So it’s how do you make those contacts and those relationships as a way of filling your pipeline probably indirectly in B2C sales, but where we do B2B, it’s absolutely direct. So keep that in mind today. It’s absolutely applicable no matter where you are, but there will be probably a bent on it as we get into this on B2B terminology, but absolutely applicable in B2C.

Speaker 1 (04:17):

Yeah, awesome. I can’t wait. So let’s look at how we can get our foot in the door with new customers without being pushy, and I think that’s the key today.

Speaker 2 (04:27):

Yeah, it is. And I want to start off with the 500 pound gorilla, which is people’s relationship to sales. I think we can’t get stuck into a conversation around this unless we really lift the lid on this a little bit, but why do you think that so many trades, business owners, ones we talk to, just people in general have that feeling about where they hate sales?

Speaker 1 (04:49):

I think it comes because no one likes to be sold to, no one does, and I think that when someone doesn’t like to be sold to, then they put themselves as a salesperson in the position of their customers and they don’t want to feel like they’re pushy or overselling or worse yet the whole stigma around sales where you don’t ever want to feel like you are that slimy sleazy sales guy, and we won’t talk about the industry that a lot of those people exist in, but I think so many people just have a negative connotation towards sales that they just don’t want to be that guy. And I think that’s why most people have a negative relationship with sales and they don’t want to identify themselves as being often a salesperson.

Speaker 2 (05:39):

Yeah, I agree a hundred percent. I think what that does, it caps them at that point because if I’m not that person, I don’t want to be that person, then I’m viewing, I’m either that person or not. It’s sort of black and white in terms of the type of person you are rather than looking at sales as a skill. And I think we’ve just, as many times as people have experienced pushy salespeople, we’ve all experienced really good salespeople who aren’t pushy, they understand needs, they do all the right things, and it is an absolute skill when it’s done well that I think everyone could absolutely benefit from in their business but would enjoy if they had those skills and they took the time to learn it.

Speaker 1 (06:15):

Yeah, definitely. When I think about what is sales, sales is leadership and influence, in the end of the day, it’s leadership influence and really great communication that’s ultimately what sales is, but I think it’s the negative connotation towards the word sales is where people get all tangled up within themselves, and I think you’re right, for a lot of tradies, they got into business because they love their trade and they’re often very good with their hands and problem solving and fixing things, and they’ve just never learned the skill of the art and the craft and the skill that is sales. It’s a profession in its own just like financial management, just like management, just like leadership, they’re all learnable skills, but most tradies are good as a tradesman. They get into business, they soon realise that they suck in business, but being a good business person, one of those skill sets is being sales driven and having that skillset in sales and it’s one of those things most people are just never taught how to sell well, and it becomes one of the biggest limitations to their growth in business as well.

Speaker 2 (07:22):

It does. And I think on top of that, when they face that fact and they’re like, well, I better learn this, it’s usually when the stakes are really high, so the stakes are high because I’ve got a hole in my pipeline or the market is turning against me, or geez, we’ve got to do something about this now. So the stakes and the risk of this going bad are just raised to a whole new level, and with that comes pressure, but not only pressure, it also lends to fear.

Speaker 1 (07:47):

The problem is I would agree with that, and the problem is that especially over the last couple of years, we’ve been in a marketplace which is buoyant in the construction and trade sector. It’s a buoyant market and most business owners have been order takers, not order creators. They’ve had work land on their desk and the market’s been so buoyant that they’ve had work land on their desk, so they naturally haven’t had to get out there and sell. They haven’t had to sell because there’s been so much demand in the industry. But what’s happening at the time of recording this episode is the market is crunching and what it’s doing is exposing those business owners who haven’t put the time, the energy and the effort into consistently looking forward to proactively generate leads, sell correctly, and have a good conversion rate at the right margin, and are looking to constantly be sales led and fill their pipeline. Really happening at the moment is it’s exposing those business owners who haven’t prioritised sales in the past because they’ve been complacent resting on their laurels because the marketplace has been so good for so long.

Speaker 2 (09:10):

Yeah, I think so. I think it’s just the muscles of sales of atrophied in the industry and that has been the case. I think the other thing that comes up is that fear of rejection or failure, that idea that Jesus, this isn’t going to be nice. I don’t want to have to have those feelings.

Speaker 1 (09:25):

Yeah, I think absolutely no one likes being told no, and especially in a sales side of things, and that’s why unfortunately, and we’ll tackle this in another episode, but that’s why most people get their business out of the ground, off the relationships that they’ve got and they generate revenue and sales by account managing relationships where they have relationships and they account manage it. But to be able to grow a business bigger than yourself, you have to turn the corner from good account management to great business development and you’ve got to expand into new sectors, new markets, new relationships, new referral partners, and that’s when you’ve got to turn the corner from good account management to good business development. And this is where people get stuck because they don’t like sales, they don’t have the skillset, they fear rejection and failure, and this is what prevents them from absolutely moving forward. So we’ll tackle that in another episode around the difference between account management and business development. But today what we want to really do is show you that you don’t have to overcomplicate sales and there’s a real process that you can follow to be able to get your foot in the door with new customers without being that sleazy, slimy sales guy that so many people label in the marketplace.

Speaker 2 (10:46):

Yeah, I think you’re right, and I think that’s a good point to start from. Is there anything else you’d say if the person who’s listening that is still like, well, I’m still clam it up, I’ve got sweaty palms and I dunno if I really want to go through listening to this, what would be sort of the point to hit home on that mindset to allow you to at least break it open and start the journey if this is your first time of going right, I’m going to give this a serious crack.

Speaker 1 (11:08):

Yeah, I think you have to remember that sales is the lifeblood of your business and there’s no two ways around it. It’s one of the most important skill sets that as a business owner you have to develop and it’s just something that you’ve got to learn and practise and just do more and more and more of and just get better and better at it. And the more you do it, the more comfortable you’ll get at it. It’s one of those things where you have to remember that you might have the best product or the best service out there in the marketplace that you can’t sell a secret. And unfortunately there’s so many trades businesses out there who their product and their service sucks, but they’re just really, really good salespeople and it’s really sad to see because no doubt you’ve got great workmanship, you’ve got good quality, great team, and you do amazing work. But if you don’t have the ability to sell that which is good communication, good leadership and good influence to be able to get that awareness out in the marketplace, then you’re never going to be able to succeed. So I think it’s always remembering that sales is the lifeblood and you just have to embrace it and get better at it, and this is what sets you up for long-term success in your business is your ability to constantly be sales led as a business.

Speaker 2 (12:29):

Yeah, I love it. And I think you’re right. I think that idea, you can’t sell a secret and it’s a skill that really hits home. I think you’ve got to channel that growth mindset, that idea or at least challenge the fixed mindset that says you can’t do it or it’s a type of person you’ve either got it or you don’t. If that’s in your mind as you’re listening to this, this is the first challenge or hurdle you’re going to have to overcome. So from a coaching point of view, I think rather than telling yourself thinking that you’d better not try, you haven’t got the talent, you’re just not that guy. You have to be willing to sort of say that you can learn the skills and you’re willing to practise and you can over time, you will get better at this as it goes forward. Everyone does. So I think having that as a starting point is a great thing, especially as we start to dive into, well, how do we go about doing this thing of filling a pipeline without being pushy.

Speaker 1 (13:18):

Especially when in times like we are in at the moment, unfortunately, most people in business only sell when they’re backed into a corner and they have to. And the most successful clients that we have here at Pravar is they have they’re sales led and they understand that they run a sales led organisation. Obviously you’ve got to have a great product, great service, great deliverables, great operations to be able to back up that sales, but if you want to be able to have a business that’s enduring for the long term, you have to be a sales led organisation. There’s no two ways about it.

Speaker 2 (13:51):

Yeah, easiest way to smooth out that bumpy ride of business is to make sure your pipeline’s full or able to be filled. That’s key.

(14:00):

Alright let’s get into it. Let’s start talking about this now and start to hit home on a few points. Before we do, I was thinking about this and I think what we’ll do today is for the rest of this episode or for the next couple of sections, let’s talk through as if we’ve got a scenario going. So let’s you adopt role of coach Rob. I’ll sort of play the trad or the other end of that as we go through, well what are the steps. So if you can coach me through it for the listener to hear that and I’ll try and ask those questions that they might be having and hear how you would take someone on that journey to start to develop this skill. I think the strategy is one thing, everyone sort of knows the strategy, but how do you think about this in a way that gets you to actually take the action? So I think that would be really cool you up to that.

Speaker 1 (14:44):

Yep, let’s do it.

Speaker 2 (14:45):

Alright, so let’s talk about the first thing and I know the first steps, I’m going to introduce that and then I’ll say it to you on this way. So I’m just not sure Rob, as a tradie, I don’t know who I’d go to. I’ve sort of gone through and I’ve been through, I heard the rings, I did part one and I’ve exhausted my contacts, there’s no one else I can talk to. It’s pretty dry out there and it’s pretty hard. What do I do?

Speaker 1 (15:08):

The first thing we’ve got to be able to do is spend the time and invest the time upfront to be able to create your dream client list. So you’ve got to be able to identify your target market upfront and it’s super important. Where most people go wrong is they chase any work and they use a scattered gun approach. Rather than thinking like a sniper, let’s be super targeted in who we want to approach. So if I’m a sparky and I do work for builders, for example, I live in Bayside in Melbourne, and if I might do high-end renovation extensions, new builds for example, say that’s the market that I’m in, then what I would be doing is I would be looking at the top 20 builders that I want to go and work for in the market, in the region, in this space and I almost choose who I want to go after, not wait for them to come to me.

Speaker 2 (16:13):

So is that the people that I want to work with or the people that I think I can get if I was to approach them and try and sell to them.

Speaker 1 (16:21):

It’s who you want to work for. So you are doing your market research and the thing is is that the industry’s quite a small industry. The reality is it’s quite a small industry anyway. Everyone knows, most people, especially if you work in a certain market either in a capital city, you’re a regional area, you generally know who the good builders are for example, especially in this area. So it’s not who you think you can get the foot in the door with. It’s who do you want to get your foot in the door with and then get really, really clear on who those top 20 builders might be and then that becomes your target list of who you want to approach over the next 12 to 18 months.

Speaker 2 (17:07):

So that then I get that so I can do that, I can pull up who I want to work with. I think I’ve got that covered. Now the thing that I then think about well is I don’t want to be pushy. I’m just going to knock on their door and go, Hey, give me work. That to me sounds pushy. What would I do to try and not go into that straight away?

Speaker 1 (17:26):

Yeah. One of the things we’ve got to remember with sales is sales is all about relationships and the best way to be able to build a relationship is to be able to find common ground. It’s super important and what we can love about the world with social media these days is everyone’s got an Instagram account and they’ve got a Facebook account and they’re all over social media. And so once, who are your top 20 businesses that you might want to be able to do work for, then you want to be able to go to the lab below that to be able to work out well either who are the owners or who might be the estimators or project managers that you’ve got to be able to get your foot in the door with. And then you go and do your market research on those people and you work out, do some research on them. What are their hobbies, what school do they go to, what are the common interests that you can find with those people so you can understand a bit about who they are, what they do, and what do they love doing in life outside of work because that’s your connection point to be able to get your foot in the door and build that rapport early on in the sales conversation.

Speaker 2 (18:43):

So I’m not showing up at these places, I’m not stalking them online, I’m using this information to build rapport when the conversation comes.

Speaker 1 (18:54):

Correct. You want to be able to use that as a conversation pointer. That’s your way of breaking down the barriers to find those commonalities to be able to start the conversation. Because if you love camping and fishing for example, and you are trying to get your foot in the door of the builder and you know that all over their Instagram, they go travelling, they’ve just been on a three week holiday with their family. Once you do get the foot in the door with that person, you can go, oh mate, I saw that a couple of months ago. You went camping up the cape, how was it? Tell me a bit about it. My family loves camping as well, and boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. That’s the conversation going. So you got to remember that in sales people do business with those that they know, like and trust and the best way to be able to build rapport and trust is to get human to human, person to person at that level. And the best way to build that rapport is understand who they are, find the common interest, not manufacture something, but you can use that as a leverage point to be able to start opening the dialogue to be able to get to know them as a person, not just as a prospect.

Speaker 2 (20:07):

Yeah, I can feel that. I think that’d be good because if I did that then it’s not me being a sleazy salesperson, it’s me being someone more aligned to the person I’m trying to work with that builder who I’m trying to get in the door with. I like that. I think I could do that. What if though I have a look for this guy and he lives in a whole different world because some of the builders I want to work with, I don’t think they’re the camping type, but my interests are probably going to be different to their, so if I can’t find a hobby or something like a trip or something like that, what could I do?

Speaker 1 (20:37):

The other areas to look for is to look for things like where did they go to school? Where do their kids, you might be able to ask around your mates in the industry, Hey, do you know such and such over there? Can you help me get a foot in the door? Or you can do some research to be able to find out who is that person, where do their kids go to school, where do they go to school? Are they members at local sporting club and all those types of things. It’s your ability just to be able to ask around in your networks because the industry is pretty small, remember? And if you’ve got the ability to be able to ask your plumber mates and your roofing mates and all the other subtrades that might be on that, those job sites, it’s your ability to be able to find out, get referrals, get foots in the door, get introductions, or if you notice that those builders have got job boards up around and they’ve got their hoarding up on a certain job when you do make the call, which we’ll talk about next, it’s your ability to be able to reference that and go, Hey mate. And when you’re on the phone to them you can go, Hey mate, I saw that you are doing this job down on x, Y, Z street. Hey I love that build. That looks amazing. Hey, can we talk a bit about how we might be able to do some work for you guys and have you got any other builds coming up? So what you’re trying to do is find these ice icebreakers, find these common grounds, find that ability to be able to build relationships and rapport with your target market. So it just takes away the feeling of doing sales and what you’re doing is building relationships.

Speaker 2 (22:14):

Yeah, it feels like just a conversation with a guy you’ve sort of just met and you’re just having a chat at this stage that sounds a lot less pressured.

Speaker 1 (22:21):

Correct. And I think this is where so many tradies, they overcomplicate sales way too much. You don’t have to do a shotgun approach and go and target everyone, be a sniper, be strategic, don’t overcomplicate it. You don’t have to over manufacture this whole process. You’ve just got to be really clear on who you want to target and then just be you and just have a genuine conversation builder to trad. Let’s have a chatter about how we can do some work together. It’s not that difficult.

Speaker 2 (22:52):

Alright, I think if we get to that chat it’d be good. So I understand that. So I’m going to build this list. I’m going to have roundabout 20 on there. I’ll know some common interests, I’ll know their name. I’ll get the contact details that I can get. I’ll ask for introductions if I can. Cool. What do I do then? I mean having that chat as you just said, I get to that point, but where I really struggle then is that first introduction. That’s probably the scariest thing in terms of just walking up and starting that conversation. So how do I do that? How do I introduce myself?

Speaker 1 (23:22):

Yeah, this is where fear kicks in and if anyone who’s done business development before, this is where they put it in their diary, got to make sales calls, this is where the palms get sweaty and then they procrastinate over stuff. This is where procrastination kicks in because this is where you’ve got to feel that fear if you’re experiencing it. Couple of different strategies, least resistance to most resistance least resistance for me would be leveraging social media and that’s where you can literally hide behind your phone or your computer. And the way that you do that is the first thing you can do is go and jump onto your Instagram account or your Facebook and go and follow them. Once you know who your top 20 builders are, go and follow all those builders and then you start liking their posts and start commenting on their posts.

(24:18):

And that’s a really great way to be able to break the ice because what you’re doing is they’ll put a post up on where they’re up to on a stage of a build like it, comment it and go, Hey mate, looks really awesome. Great job, keep up the great work. And you’re starting to create that dialogue over a one to two to three month period where you’re starting to interact with someone online. Once you start getting that little bit of rapport happening, then that’s when you can start getting in and send them a message and go, Hey Dan, awesome work on that. Build down on x, y, z street. The builder’s looking amazing. Hey, is there a chance that we can catch up for a coffee? You can tell me a bit about what’s going on in your world. I can tell you a bit about what’s going on in my world and maybe you can shoot across a set of plans and hey, can I price some work for you?

Speaker 2 (25:08):

Yeah, nice. And that would feel like I was doing that almost. And I know I haven’t met the guy in person yet, but the one I’ve got in mind that would almost feel like I’ve got some relationship with him already, I sort of know a bit about their world. It’s not completely freezing cold when I knock on that door.

Speaker 1 (25:22):

Yeah, correct. And I look at it when I’m on Instagram, I follow certain builders and I follow certain subtrades and it’s amazing that they all follow each other and they all like each other. I’ve just gone through a renovation extension in my house and I’ve gone and liked all these different suppliers and designers and architects and builders and subtrades, it’s amazing in our local area, everyone just follows and comments and likes on each other. So it’s amazing that there’s the whole six degrees of separation is always there. And so if you’ve got the ability to and comment and give them a pat on the back and then send them a direct message, you don’t have to overcomplicate it. Hey, how are you? Awesome job. Is there any way that we can catch up in person, have a coffee and talk a bit about what you’ve got coming up and see how I can help. You’re not selling there. All you’re doing is saying, how can I help?

Speaker 2 (26:16):

So is that the thing? I mean I know you mentioned lease to most resistance and I’ll get nervous about even hearing the words to the most sort of resistance, but when you start talking about that, what would the next steps be from social media? Are we on the phone or is there a middle ground or what else could I do?

Speaker 1 (26:33):

I think the middle piece from the next layer of resistance is a cold email where you send them an email or a copy of something like an introduction video or a capability statement for example. You’ve got to remember though, that’s a high volume low percentage of conversion where you are writing an email going, hi, Dan, wanted to introduce myself. Where X, Y, Z? Here’s a copy of our capability statement. I’m not sure if you’re on the hunt for a spark at the moment, by the way, here’s a little bit about us. Would there be a time that we can catch up? Obviously you can script it in different ways, but that’s the essence of the email. It’s a low probability side of things and it’s a little bit impersonal if I’m honest. My preference is the social media because you’ve got to remember social media is relationship based. Emails can very easily get into the bin, they get put in junk or they just get deleted because people get a tonne of emails every day. But it is a different approach and I know that we’ve had a lot of our clients have had successes by doing cold outreach from an email campaign that they have tackled.

Speaker 2 (27:48):

Yeah, I think if you could weave in some of that stuff we talked about earlier of if I’m getting this right, the stuff that we talked around in terms of the connections that we might have, it would soften that coldness or it’d heat up that email a little bit. That’d be good. I think that’s where I’ve done it in the past. If I’m being honest, I’d use email because maybe I’m okay with someone not replying to an email. It’ll piss me off, but I’m okay with that. It’s not the sort of rejection that I might get say from, I dunno if you’re going to talk about this, but maybe a cold phone call where I’m actually it’s smack you in the face.

Speaker 1 (28:25):

Yeah, it is. And if someone’s not interested, they just won’t respond to your email and I definitely agree with you around the personalisation with it where it might be, Hey Dan, hey, awesome work on the build that you’re doing over on Bob Street. One of my mates, Frank, who’s a plumber, is doing some work with you guys and he threw your name across to me. Would you be interested in catching up for a coffee? This is who we are as a sparky. We’re looking at taking on some more builders at the moment I’ve done, I thought it might be of interest if we could meet and we can talk about how we might be able to help each other out. So what you’re doing is leveraging that research you’ve done in the past to be able to make those connections, makes it more personal, softens the blow. You’ve got that rapport up front. There you go. You get cracking from there.

Speaker 2 (29:25):

Alright, cool. I get that. That’s good. Now what about the one, I had this the other week, I was driving around in my van, I saw the company on my list and I know that there’s someone I’ve always wanted to work with and all I’ve got is a phone number. Should I ring that number and just see how I go or how do I use the phone?

Speaker 1 (29:44):

Yeah, this is number three around probably most resistance because this is where you are actually dialling a number, making a cold outreach, and this is where rejection is high, but it gets the best cut through, if I’m honest. This is where you would ring up and say you did see that sign and that number. Hey Dan, how are you? Rob from X, Y, Z Sparky company. Hey, great to talk to you. Can I grab five minutes of your time? Hey, I was just driving past one of your job sites and looked amazing. There’s that connection. Hey, we’re looking at taking on some new builders at the moment. I was wondering if I can grab a few minutes of your time just to get to know you a little bit, find out a bit about you and see if you’re on the hunt for a new sparky at the moment and if you’ve got any jobs coming up, if there’s anything we can price for you and if they’ve got two or three sparkies that they’ve already got going working well for them it might be, yeah, you know what, Rob, thanks very much, but we’re not interested.

(30:44):

Okay, cool. No worries. But you just never know when you ring, they might have one of their sparkies balls up at one of their job sites. They might’ve just walked off site and had the shits, one of their sparkies and you just got them at the right time. You make the phone call and you never know when you can get the foot in the door to be able to give a competitive price. And so I think the beauty of making a phone call is you get straight in there and you’ve just got to put in the time and the effort and make the calls and not be afraid if someone says no and you’ve got to remember if they do say no, they’re not rejecting you, it’s just that they’re not interested now and you never know in the future if you do follow them up over a 6 or 12 month period. But if they say no, who cares? Move on to the next one. You’ve got 19 other people on your contact list.

Speaker 2 (31:34):

And from what you’ve just described, we’re not actually talking about a set opportunity or a job and it’s not a no to ever. It’s a no, not yet. And I could ring up again probably and say, Hey, really love that job. I know I spoke to you a few months ago, but I’m just, I’m persistent if nothing else. So I thought I’d give you a shout and see where you’re up to.

Speaker 1 (31:56):

Yeah, correct. And I know that even I experienced this a couple of weeks ago, I spoke to a business owner around joining coaching, I think it was 18 months ago and he said, no Rob, I’m not interested. I’m like, okay, cool. Kept him on there, kept communication going, rebooked a call in about a month ago. He was in a different stage of his journey, different time, different headspace, ready to do something, bang off we go now we’re doing some great work together. And he jumped on board with in the launch programme, can’t wait to get stuck in with him. And so just because it’s a no now, it’s not a no forever and you remember all they’re doing is saying no to a catch up and it’s not that you’ve even pitched anything, you haven’t sold anything yet. You’re not even proposing any pricing for any plans. And so we can’t be discouraged if someone does say no to us.

Speaker 2 (32:53):

If that’s what it is that you follow as a system, then that doesn’t sound pushy, which is what I was really hoping we’d do is not get to a point where I’m being pushy or having to break down doors, wolf of Wall Street style and try and get these deals over the line in a pushy or a sketchy sort of way, which feels good. So if I can do the introduction then and I can say hi to someone, then I suppose what have you got in terms of probably what to say would be the next thing I think I sort of know, but what would you say is important when we start the actual conversation when I do get the opportunity to speak to these people?

Speaker 1 (33:28):

Yeah, I think it’s important to remember that you don’t want to go in there and start pitching straight away and start selling on the first meeting. And so what’s really important to remember is that you go in there with a view of building a relationship in the B2C sales, it’s quite transactional. You generate a lead, you make a sale. Sometimes there’s a repeat business down the line, but it’s a transactional relationship. When you’re in the B2B game, it’s relationship based and you might do work for half a dozen builders and those half a dozen builders generate $2 million worth of work for your business on a yearly basis. And so if you’ve got the ability to pick up an average job worth 50, 80, 100 grand and you can get a few of them per year, it’s worth investing time upfront to be able to build a relationship with someone that you know get to like them and you feel like you can trust them. If you can do that, then that relationship can pay dividends for years and years and years to come. So I think from the onset, don’t have the mindset where you go into sell straight away, go in there to be able to get to know them, they get to know you and the first part of the sale is booking a meeting and that meeting can either be over zoom or better yet in person having a coffee or going catching up for lunch or something.

Speaker 2 (35:02):

Yeah, I like it. I like it. I think that’s good. Again, it’s so low, it’s way lower and way less pushy than probably what I was thinking.

Speaker 1 (35:10):

Correct. And then once you’ve done the research on step one, then when you do catch up with that person, you don’t even talk business to begin with. Talk commonalities around fishing, camping where your kids go to school, maybe they’re a member of the certain sporting club, maybe they follow carton like you do Dan, and you can talk carton all day long about how good they’re going this season and talk about all the things that you have common interest in. Now don’t bullshit because you’ll get caught out because they’ll go and say, who’s your favourite Carlton player? And if you asked me that, I’d go fucks me. I don’t even know who’s on the team, but so don’t a commonality. But if you do your research right, that’s where you break all the ice, get to know them as a person and it’s way easy to build trust and rapport with someone that you’ve got common interest in.

Speaker 2 (36:05):

I love it. I think that’s great. So I’m going to break out of my client mode for a minute and just sort of say if we wanted to just quickly summarise Rob, then hopefully for the listener, that helps break down I think the three steps you said, but do you want to just give it in summary format rather than the conversation we’ve had, just the titles and sort of those three key steps as we’ve outlined or as you’ve outlined them just in that little role play we did?

Speaker 1 (36:29):

Yeah. I think number one is making sure you identify your target market super important, do the research upfront and once you’ve got the research done upfront, then make sure you schedule time in your diary to actually do business development work consistently. Target marketing also helps you be productive when you do your business development time. You don’t have to sit there and think, oh shit, who am I going to contact today? You’ve already done your research, you know who you need to contact, then you’ve just got to wipe your sweaty palms, start punching digits in your phone and start making phone calls. So step number one is identify your target market. Number two is make the call or use social media or do email depending on what your preferred platform is and put in the effort to put your foot forward to be able to introduce yourself and introducing yourself is super important.

(37:26):

If you get rejected, who cares? Move on to the next one. And point number three is don’t sell everything up front. Just get your foot in the door, make the introduction and get to a meeting. That’s the most important thing you can do. And then offer to help. You’re here to help you remember you’re here to price some work or how are they going with their existing sparky or what can we do to be able to help you and price a first set of plans and be prepared. They’re going to price check you and then you’ll set another set price, another set, and they’ll price check you again. But if you can just get your foot in the door, make it low friction, low salesy, make it all about relationships and get to know them, but make sure you’re getting in there and adding value to them, then you’ve got the ability to build on that relationship and eventually you’ll get a job and then prove yourself in that job and get going and then you’ve got a client’s wife.

Speaker 2 (38:22):

Yeah, I love it. It is the mode and the method that we teach and coach guys on. What we just went through is literally conversations you and I have had with hundreds of clients over the years in terms of how do you go out and answer this question of filling your pipeline without being pushy. These are the three steps we’d recommend to anyone, correct?

Speaker 1 (38:39):

Yep. It’s a sales 1 0 1. There’s no advanced sales strategies here. It’s just the fundamentals of good sales. And I think the most important thing that you can do when you’re listening to this is get out of your own way and just get on with a job which is sales and stop resting on your laurels and stop relying on your existing customers to push work your way. If they’re becoming a little bit quiet at the moment, guess what? You are going to become quiet. So don’t wait for you to become quiet or quieter than you are at the moment. Get out there on the front foot and start generating new relationships and get out of your own way and just get on with the job.

Speaker 2 (39:18):

Yeah, I think the thing when you talk about generating relationships, I always go to that. And the other thing is it’s all about generating relationships and uncovering opportunities and that’s different to sales. If I’m going to go and have a conversation with a builder around something and say, Hey, want to catch up and just see what opportunities you have at the moment, it’s very different into, hey, do you want to buy us? And can we come and do all this sort of stuff? The pressure and the friction, I love that word you used is way lower. If we’re looking to uncover opportunities or see what’s possible, it’s really low pressure both sides, which I think helps.

Speaker 1 (39:50):

Why do you think it helps?

Speaker 2 (39:53):

From my perspective, I think the main thing with sales as I was taught in B2B sales is you’ve got to make your customer feel safe. The minute a customer doesn’t feel safe, you’re going to have issues. Things are going to slow down, they’re going to go missing. I think that whole idea around the minute someone gets their guard up, everything sort of grinds to a halt and it gets really hard really quick. But we’ve all had that experience of this is great, it feels like we’ve known each other for a while, we clicked really well, they want to have another meeting, I’ll see ’em next week. And we’ve got that momentum with it. And I think that’s because both of you feel safe, which comes back to no like and trust. I think the other thing is when we start to sell is we ramp it up so quick we’re in a hurry to sell. Whether we’re under pressure from a business perspective, we’ve got to make these numbers. We’re in a pressure because of the market, whatever it is, we make it really, we’re really desperate for that sale. But what we end up doing is make it really easy for someone on the other end, like a builder to go, I’m not interested. And it makes it really easy to say no to you rather than making it easy to say yes.

Speaker 1 (40:58):

In sales that’s called commission breath. You’re desperate. You don’t want to have commission breath, you don’t want to be desperate in a sale. And so yeah, you’re right. It’s that ability just to be cool, calm, collected, and be that guy who wants to help someone. And if you can go there with the ability to add value to people, then that’s why it’s important in step one is to find people you actually want to work with. If you do go and work with builders, go and find the best builders in the area that you absolutely like their workmanship, like the builds that they do. You feel that there’s viability in the types of work that they do and go and tap ’em on the shoulder and go, Hey man, you’re doing some awesome work. How do I be a part of it? How can I help? And I think if you just be you and if they’ve got an opening, it’s going to turn into a magical relationship. And then you’ve got a great client who can pass work to you all day long and you can add a lot of value to them.

Speaker 2 (41:54):

Yeah, I like it. And I think speaking of adding value, I was thinking about this. What if we did for the listener today? One of these things that we do a lot is we’ve got these sort of conversations and not so much templates, but just certain phrases and how we do things. Maybe we could put a template of an email requesting a meeting. How do you ask for a meeting that’s easy to say yes to and hard to say no into the Facebook group? So what I’m thinking of is that phrase we use all the time, and think about this as you listen, it’s a phrase in the body of an email, but it goes along the lines of if you have 10 minutes for a quick chat in the next two or three weeks, please let me know and I’d love to introduce myself in person.

(42:38):

I’m in the area and I’d love to shout you a coffee, something like that. But the key thing is that if you have 10 minutes in the next two to three weeks, it’s very different than saying, oh, I’m glad you picked up the phone. Have you got 20 minutes so I can run you through what we do and see if there’s anything we can have. I guarantee one will work better than the other. And what we’re trying to do with that phrase or that sentence is to make it easy to say yes to and hard to say no, it’s hard to say no. If you’ve got 10 minutes in the next two or three weeks, who are you? Like the president of the United States or something who hasn’t got 10 minutes within two or three week time span? It’s hard to not come across as much as the salesperson doesn’t want to be pushy, the person that’s being sold to doesn’t want to sound like a jerk either most of the time.

(43:21):

So I think we can do that for the listeners. And you have to be in The Trade Den Facebook group, which we’d love to see you in there and it’s growing every week. But I think putting that in there will give people a sense of how you’d phrase some of this stuff. And you’d use those conversations, those key phrases, no matter what you were doing, whether it was in social media, if it was on the email, even on a phone call, how do you go about it? And learning that pacing is really important in sales because if we push too hard, they feel unsafe and they pull back. If we do it right, they’re happy to go along the journey and be led by us.

Speaker 1 (43:53):

Great. Should we put a bow around today?

Speaker 2 (43:56):

Let’s do it. Key takeaways.

Speaker 1 (44:00):

Number one for me is don’t overcomplicate the sales or business development process. It’s just a hell of a lot easier than you think. And I think as we’ve been through today, it’s not that hard. What stops people is fear and procrastination because they’re overcomplicating it. So take away for me number one is just don’t over complicate it. It’s easier than you realise.

Speaker 2 (44:28):

Great. For me, I think the one I took out of it and what I’d like to really punch home is that sales is a learnable skill. It doesn’t matter who you are, what you do, it is like you can always be fitted by going to the gym, but if you don’t show up, you don’t do the reps, you don’t get better, you don’t get fitter. But provided you’re willing to commit to mastering the skill, or not even mastering it, but just having a go at it with an open mind and the idea that I’m going to get better over time. That growth mindset as we talked about, I think that for me is the key thing. It is a skill and it’s learnable and anyone can really learn how to do it well.

Speaker 1 (45:01):

Yeah, and the last one for me is be consistent. And like anything in life, the more consistent you are, the better results you’re going to get. Unfortunately, most business owners only do business development when their pipeline’s drying up or their back’s against the wall and it’s too late. It’s way too late. And so the only way that you are going to continue to grow your business is by consistently prioritising business development and expanding your networks and expanding your customer base to be able to work with more people who can generate leads to be able to make more sales. And so consistency is the key to your success and it’s definitely the key to good sales and filling out your pipeline over the long term.

Speaker 2 (45:51):

I love it. I love it. Alright, action steps. So if you’re listening today, your action step from today’s episode is to go and create your dream client list. Set a target for the new context you want to have each week. Make a commitment to actually follow through and reach out and introduce yourself. So those first two steps we talked about, get your research done, get yourself in order to have a really confident conversation, and then put in the work. That’s step one. And then step two is jump into the Facebook group on The Trade Den and you can pick up that template for the email, which will have some of those key phrases we’ll highlight and put some notes in the margin there so you can see the key points we’ve raised out of today’s episode. But you can take that, use it and see how you go generating the leads and the conversations and building those relationships that are going to fill your pipeline without you coming across as being pushy.

Speaker 1 (46:42):

Sounds good. And if you love today’s episode and you’ve got some value in it and you know that you’re in that position where your pipeline might be drying up at the moment or you are looking to continue to expand your business and you’d like some help with this, then get a call booked in from the link in the show notes and book a call in with myself and let’s spend a bit of time together to be able to identify who your target market is, how you’re going to go about approaching it, and we can sharpen up your approach. And let’s see if we can do something to be able to help you. Maybe we can, maybe we can’t, I don’t know. But let’s have a conversation and see where it takes us and see how we might be able to help you to be able to help you grow your pipeline.

Speaker 2 (47:23):

Yeah, introduce yourself to Rob. Be one of the best calls you can make.

Speaker 1 (47:27):

Excellent. Hopefully enjoy today’s conversation. Lots of golden nuggets from it and always looking forward to being able to be in your ears next week with part three of this series around filling your pipeline. Thanks guys.

Speaker 2 (47:43):

See you soon.

(47:43):