Episode 43 Podcast Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):

I had to stop managing the day-to-day operations of the business because if I didn’t, then my phone would constantly be ringing. I had to become that leader to lead my managers essentially to give them the capacity and the capability to be able to run the jobs without me being there.

Speaker 2 (00:19):

Hi everyone. Rob Kropp here from Pravar Group. Welcome back to another episode of The Trade Den podcast. Welcome back Dan. Good to have you here.

Speaker 3 (00:27):

Thanks, Rob. Good to be back. Love these sessions. We’re ready for another client story and this one I think is going to be a belter. We love this guy and we’ve both spent a lot of time with him, so keen to get this one underway.

Speaker 2 (00:38):

Yeah. Should we give Frank from RFV Property Services? A big warm welcome to the podcast.

Speaker 3 (00:45):

Yes, well done. Welcome, Frank.

Speaker 2 (00:47):

How are you guys? Great to have you on, mate. Really looking forward to having you in for today’s conversation. And yeah, big warm welcome.

Speaker 1 (00:56):

Thanks man. Looking forward to getting into it.

Speaker 3 (01:00):

Alright. Hey Rob, before we start, I want to start this one today rather than jump, we’ll jump to you in a minute, Frank, but I love the story of Frank’s first call and what came out of that first call you had and how it all played out. Maybe we can share that. And then Frank, I’m going to ask you to do the usual roll call. Who are you, how long have you been doing it and all that good stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:21):

Yeah, absolutely. I remember this one as clear as day because when clients come to us, they, they’re trapped, confused, and they have no idea how the hell they’re going to get out of the situation that they found themselves in. For Frank, he was just working crazy hours business and life was hectic and he just knew he needed to make a lot of change. And normally when I run this, a strategy call or mapping out where they are, where they’re going to go, working all on all these strategies, and I remember a conversation, Frank, we had a little while after you’re like, Rob, I didn’t believe you, but I knew that I needed to make change and I just put my faith in you and off we went and it just all came true. I just love those. I love when a strategy becomes a reality and it was one of those times where sometimes you just got to have faith in someone and the path in front of you and gee, we’ve made some bloody amazing changes. And yeah, it’s a testament for Frank and all the hard work he’s put in. So yeah, I remember that call. It was just yesterday.

Speaker 3 (02:32):

You remember that one, Frank?

Speaker 2 (02:34):

I do.

Speaker 3 (02:36):

I think you said just as we started to load up for today, you’re even sitting in the same chair, so that’s pretty cool too.

Speaker 1 (02:42):

A hundred percent. And yeah, looking back now to think how far we’ve come in the last few years is unbelievable. So yeah, crazy.

Speaker 3 (02:50):

For sure. All right, let’s kick it off. Let’s get into it, mate. Do you want to tell us who you are, what you do, where do you do it, and how long you’ve been doing it for?

Speaker 1 (02:58):

So as you know, my name’s Frank. I’m from RFV Property Services. I run a property maintenance and painting company in Sydney, so we pretty much work Sydney City and Eastern suburbs. I’ve been doing this for the last 10 years.

Speaker 3 (03:14):

Awesome. And how long have you been in coaching for now?

Speaker 1 (03:17):

Just under three years.

Speaker 3 (03:18):

Just under three years. All right. Let’s remember that if you’re listening, remember that because we’re about to go on a whirlwind of a journey in just under three years. Frank, when you joined Launch, so after you’ve had your strategy call with Rob and you’ve been through all the promises and all the good stuff and you’ve decided to go along for the ride, can you remember what your primary goal or challenge was in your mind? What were you trying to either overcome, get yourself free of or move forward from?

Speaker 1 (03:48):

Yeah, so I called Rob because I just found out my wife was pregnant with twins and I was just like, what am I going to do now? I was working seven days a week, crazy hours, had barely any family time to begin with, so when we found out about that my world just came down, I didn’t know what I was going to do. And then after that strategy called Rob’s set up and that timeline and what I had to do to put in place to get into a more comfortable position, a manageable position, and I didn’t believe it at the time, but yeah, twins came and we did it.

Speaker 3 (04:24):

Awesome. Really cool. Can you remember coming into the programme? I mean, you hadn’t done any coaching at that time. It was pretty much a foreign sort of concept. I think you had one person that you knew of that had even heard of us. What was it like walking into the programme cold? How did you feel?

Speaker 1 (04:43):

It was different. I was pretty much self-taught everything that I had done up until that point. Yeah, different is the word. I didn’t know what to expect. I had no expectation, didn’t know what to expect, but it was a good feeling knowing I had someone to ask the question to and to lean on instead of just going in my gut field and just winging it.

Speaker 3 (05:06):

Awesome. Did you get a lot of, when you say it was good to lean on someone, was it confidence that those initial of weeks gave it to you? Was it sort of a safety net or was it something like it was inspirational? What was the overarching feeling that you got out of going into launch In the beginning?

Speaker 1 (05:20):

It was inspirational because as you said, I knew a guy that was in here and I’d seen what he had accomplished in his time. So I knew it was possible and for me it was the safety and just being able to talk to someone about what I need to do and where I need to go to get out of where I was I suppose, or the situation I was in.

Speaker 3 (05:42):

Yeah. Did you do a lot, I mean a lot of guys, like Rob said at the beginning, they’re trapped, they’re confused, there’s a lot of talk within themselves. Did you have anyone you could talk to really before then? Where were you going for that support without the coaching or the framework of Pravar around you?

Speaker 1 (05:56):

Yeah, family and friends, but it was pretty much all on me just getting a bit of information from my mate who runs his own business, my parents, a bit of family, whatever. But at the end of the day, there was no, it was just what they do and I had to make my own decisions and go track the best way I could without really knowing.

Speaker 3 (06:19):

So trying to avoid some of the pitfalls still, even though you were getting advice from all areas and probably some of that was conflicting and not really giving you the clarity you needed to move forward. Exactly.

(06:28):

Right. So let’s go a little bit deeper. I want to come back to the theme for you today. I think Frank and your story is really about creating balance and order across all what we call the pillars in your world. So we’re going to use that as sort of a bit of a backdrop for today’s conversation. So coaching at Pravar if you’re listening, is a holistic experience. There’s four legacies that we talk about as primary legacies being business connections, health and wealth. So across those four, I don’t think there’s any of those areas that you haven’t delved into and absolutely smashed out of the park the last just under three years. There’s that reminder again. But in terms of that, I think today let’s talk about each of these legacies and I think for each programme that you’ve been in, now that you’re in lifestyle, I think there’s been a real key theme that we can dive into. So I’m keen to understand, and Rob jump in with your thoughts on this, but talking through each of the legacies as you’ve sort of attacked them in each of the programmes. So if we start off with launch and business legacy, can you remember the very first leavers or the very first challenge that was set out for you to start working on business?

Speaker 1 (07:35):

So coming into launch, my wife, the twins I had four months before the twins were going to be born, and in that time what we had to do was hire an admin and hire only was a big one, and hire another tradesman to get me off the tools to be able to give me a bit of freedom, to have a bit of time off with the family when that time came. So they were my two first big levers that I pulled in launch in the first couple of months, game changer up later on in launch. I then got out of home, got into an office and I’ve expanded my crew a little bit, so I got a few more guys on the ground and that was pretty much my launch journey.

Speaker 3 (08:19):

How scary was that for you at the time? Obviously you hadn’t had that before, there’d been no support, no, the concept of having an admin or staff around you, what was that like?

Speaker 1 (08:28):

It was a weird feeling at first telling someone to do a job that I barely knew how to do myself essentially, but it was a big relief knowing that once we got to the point where it was she was able to take the workload off me, it made my life so much easier and it was actually a big weight off my shoulders.

Speaker 2 (08:54):

And they were really big steps for you and you had a very short amount of time to make change because you already had young kids and you’re having twins on the way. 80 hour weeks were not uncommon for you. You were working pretty much full-time on the tools with a couple of guys around you. Nights and weekends were just doing admin, bookkeeping, quoting, invoicing. Your life was hectic and you were having twins on the way. If life wasn’t hectic enough, it was about to get even more hectic with twins. And so your need to make change, it wasn’t a nice to have. It was a, I must make change in the next four to six months isn’t it?

Speaker 1 (09:36):

Was a necessity. I had no other choice and I think that’s what drove me to make it happen.

Speaker 3 (09:43):

What did you do when you had to face up to that thing? I’m going to hire someone and I’ve got really, I’ll say this, I’ve got no idea really what they’re going to do or how they do their job. I’ve never done that before. I wouldn’t know how to do it, but I’m going to hire them anyway. How do you overcome that feeling of if I can’t do it, then what right have I got to hire someone in to help me have that support?

Speaker 1 (10:06):

It was, yeah, I had no right, but I had no choice, so I just had to dive in and do it and trust the system, essentially. Trust what Robert told me on that first call and follow the system and well hopefully, but be sure that that’s the right decision to be making at the time.

Speaker 3 (10:26):

So what was the instruction that you remember following, let’s go back sort of thing. First day in the office, they walk in and you’re like, all right, I’m going to give you this to do. What was the first thing that you handed over?

Speaker 1 (10:38):

I can’t remember to be honest with you. I literally sat her down and said, Hey, I don’t have a role for you, but we’re going to create one together. And she had a bit of experience in the field and she kind of guided me.

Speaker 3 (10:47):

Perfect. That’s a big thing, mate, to be able to say, I’m going to give you some responsibility and hand over responsibility when you knew nothing else but everything being on your shoulders. That’s the exact statement I was hoping you’d say, because that is the thing that cracked your world open to say that this is possible now I can see how this might work.

Speaker 1 (11:05):

It’s trusting people, trusting the people you hire to do their job. At the time it was a massive mindset, mindset issue of mine that you think you’re the best at doing everything, but you’re not.

Speaker 3 (11:20):

Yeah. And was it the same when you were hiring ground crew in terms of bringing on new guys to do that sort of stuff? Was that still foreign or you’re sort of doing more of that?

Speaker 1 (11:29):

I was doing more of that. I was having a lot of work out. It wasn’t as foreign. I still thought that I was better. I was the best person for the job, but that’s your trade and that’s what you’re good at. So you can guide them and trust them and you can look at the job and know they’re doing a good job. Whereas on the other side, the office side of things, I couldn’t really tell if she was doing a good job or not. I didn’t have anything to compare it to.

Speaker 2 (11:55):

We see that a lot in coaching where it is a big step for a lot of guys in our launch programme to be able to start getting off the tools and getting in the office and bringing support in around them. We find that guys are very good at hiring tradesmen, apprentices, leading hands, labourers because they’re from the trade, they’re from the industry, they know they’re blokes, they know how to manage them. They’ve been through that journey in your world, you’ve been a maintenance guy, you’ve been a painter, you’ve been that in the trade, but when it comes to admin and bookkeeping and eventually project manager and estimators like, hang on a second, these are white collar professional people. And now I’m dealing with a lady in the office, I’m used to managing blokes on the ground and they’re an admin person and they’re somewhat semi-professional and it’s a whole different person and profession and way of managing. A lot of guys struggle with that. And it sounds like you had that struggle as well, but you ultimately had no choice, you just had to bring them on and just work through the journey of being comfortable managing them there.

Speaker 1 (12:58):

Exactly right. And it just comes with time. You become more comfortable the more you do it, so you have to step out of your comfort zone to get comfortable I suppose.

Speaker 3 (13:08):

Can you remember a defining time when you did sort of think, right, I’m in the right place, this is going to be the journey or were you all in by this or were you in too deep to go back? What was the deal?

Speaker 1 (13:18):

I was all in from the start, but yeah, once I ticked them first couple of boxes, I had that reassurance that when my world had changed and I had that reassurance that this can happen and I can get to where I want to go. So the first couple of believers that I pulled were massive for me, for my mindset to say that I’m going in the right direction.

Speaker 2 (13:42):

It’s a big thing that we as a coaching business, we really strive to be able to work hard on when we’re bringing a new client on, and Dan and I and the coaching team work really hard as number one, we want to make sure that a client feels like they belong in the space. Number two, they believe in the process, and number three, they get a result. And if you can get those three things, that’s when a client’s all in. But that’s what we bring to the table. But a client has to bring their element to the table as well where they’ve got to go all in on the process and not come into coaching thinking, is this going to work for me? They never commit otherwise. But for you, Frank, what I loved about you coming into coaching is you had a really big reason why you needed to make change. B, you had belief that someone else, you had inspiration, maybe not belief in yourself, but you had inspiration from someone else, which kind of developed that belief, but you just went all in on this coaching journey and that’s why you’ve been able to make such big change in such a short amount of time because you’ve just fully committed to the process, didn’t you? And you made rapid change quickly, didn’t you?

Speaker 1 (14:56):

Yep, very rapid, very quickly. It had to be done. Yeah, I love it.

Speaker 3 (15:03):

One of my favourite early memories of you, Frank, is just watching you get your head around using computers and emails and links and zooms and things like that. That was quite the journey. Some of those calls and some of the commentary that you gave us around using computers was pretty cool.

Speaker 1 (15:20):

Yeah, I didn’t think you’re going to bring that up before coaching. I didn’t own a computer. I ran my whole business off my phone, as you know. So yeah, it’s been quite a journey and I think I’ve done pretty well.

Speaker 3 (15:33):

Oh, you have absolutely. I mean we were talking before and you were zipping around on, I’ve seen you zip around on spreadsheets now and sending stuff backwards and forwards. It’s amazing. I think that’s a good point though. When you talk about running your business off your phone, we mentioned this on previous episodes when it was sort of how do you stop being changed to your phone and you are pretty much our poster boy for the examples we were giving in that episode was all around someone taking hundreds of calls a day and that was you, wasn’t it your world. If you can just paint that picture for us, how was the phone in those days and what was going on?

Speaker 1 (16:07):

The phone was probably the most important thing in my life at that time. That’s where work came from. It’s what fed my family. It’s what I scheduled my days around. It was everything. It was handcuffed me 23 hours a day. If it rang in the middle of the night, I’d answer it. So it was life, but I hated it.

Speaker 3 (16:29):

And it was how many calls a day do you reckon? Conservatively?

Speaker 1 (16:33):

Yeah, probably at that time it was probably about 80 to a hundred calls a day.

Speaker 3 (16:37):

It’s a lot. It’s amazing. You could get anything else done. And obviously then having that, you said it before, it was probably the most important thing in your world because it fed your family, but at some level it was probably more important than family that you took those calls than looked at the other areas of your life. It was not a matter of am I being healthy? It wasn’t a matter of am I being connected, it was am I doing the job I need to, which in this case is answer the phone when it rings. It was as simple as that.

Speaker 1 (17:03):

Exactly right. If I didn’t answer it, kids don’t eat. So it was my world.

Speaker 3 (17:11):

Yeah. Did you have a sense of what, the question I want to ask is did you have a sense at the time what it was costing you by being so hung up with the phone so attached to it and so on the hook for when it rang trying to make time or be aware or alert to the fact that it could ring at any second, do you have any sense of what it was costing you to do that?

Speaker 1 (17:31):

Yeah, it was costing me my relationships and my wellbeing essentially because everything revolved around that, which then everything revolves around work, which then when you’re at home, you’re not present at home, you’re thinking about when’s that phone going to ring, when’s that next job going to come in? And yeah, looking back now, it was not a good place to be in, but at the time I didn’t think anything was wrong with it.

Speaker 3 (17:58):

I think this is what we talk about Rob, when we start talking about how guys need to look at their phone and their relationship with technology and things like that because when you’re in that deep and it is that important and there are valid reasons for it, but you just don’t realise the cost on the other side of it.

Speaker 2 (18:14):

Yeah, I think Frank was a smack bang in one of the hardest zones in business when it’s you and a couple of guys around you working from the kitchen table or from the spare bedroom, no admin, no bookkeeping, and your life is business. It’s one of the hardest zones you can be in because you’re doing everything from being on the tools to running the whole business and wearing every single hat. And the phone then becomes your life because you pretty much, you are the business and the business is you and you are the phone and it just becomes all consuming.

(18:53):

But just piece by piece, every time you get to put a new person into your ground crew, you get some separation from home and work by getting some premises, getting some admin on board, getting some bookkeeping on board, understanding your numbers a little bit better, getting a job management system in just piece by piece. These little things that you can implement just starts to create that separation from you and the business and then you get to delegate some of those responsibilities to other people and the phone, you start to create that separation from your phone and you start to create the separation from home and life and business. And so it just takes time, but you just got to bring in piece by piece. And Frank, I think that’s what you did as a really good job is over time you just started bringing in new strategy and made positive change and positive change and once what was a hectic world started to become a hell of a lot easier in business, didn’t it?

Speaker 1 (19:45):

Yeah, definitely. And like you said, it’s just one thing at a time. Identify what’s screaming the loudest, deal with it, move on to the next one, and over time and one thing slowly, slowly over time, you’re a hundred percent right. Life just becomes less hectic and you’ve got more control of yourself and your life.

Speaker 3 (20:05):

Also with business, I think too, you’ve got more control over your business and I think this is as we come to the end of your launch journey, what did bringing in that structure by moving into the premises that you’re in, what did that allow you to create in a business sense from that business legacy? Did you go out and do more business development and sales grow what was it?

Speaker 1 (20:24):

At that stage? Probably not so much business sales and development, but it gave me that separation from home and I actually went to work. So instead of living in my job, I actually left home and went to work. And when I was there, I was engaged and wanted to be there and did my job, whereas when I was still at home and life home, everything just blends together. You are constantly working, constantly don’t want to work. It always had a negative thing, a stigma attached to work, I suppose in my head at that point in time. So once we separated it, it gave me this new spring of life and I wanted to excel in business and make my business grow and get to the next level.

Speaker 2 (21:08):

Probably helped that your hours got completely slashed and you’re off the tools and you are more present with the family. It probably helped that those things were in your favour as well. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (21:17):

Yeah, a hundred percent. But that’s what gives you the drive to keep going I suppose as well.

Speaker 2 (21:23):

Not to mention getting out on the boat and going fishing. You love your fishing and you probably did more fishing in that time than you’d done in the years prior.

Speaker 1 (21:30):

Probably to this a little bit at that point hey.

Speaker 3 (21:33):

There was some calls and comments I think we made and some suggestions that, hey, it’s time to get back to work, that’s for sure. But that’s all good. Hey, now we’re going to go, let’s turn then so we get to the end of launch. You’ve put in this structure, you’ve got yourself in a position to be able to work on your business as opposed to like you just said, the washing machine of everything happening all at once all of the time. As you go into leverage, I think the connections business is now starting to get some momentum. You’ve got the structure in and it’s starting to roll when you go into leverage. Did you have a clear goal what it was when you went to that next phase of coaching or were you again just along for the ride?

Speaker 1 (22:11):

I had clear goals at that point, and I remember the first call we had Dan of leverage and you said, what do you want out of this thing? And I said, I want to be able to have one day off work without everything falling apart. That was my big thing.

Speaker 3 (22:23):

Awesome. And you had no idea at that time how you were going to do it. It was just literally you were clear on what you did want though.

Speaker 1 (22:29):

Yep, that’s what I wanted. That’s what I told you. And it was like a matter of putting the steps in place essentially to get there.

Speaker 3 (22:38):

And I think that remembering what it was, I think this set the theme for you was, well, who do you have to become in order to have that? It wasn’t now about, well, have you got the people? Or there was levers to be pulled and things to be looked after in a business sense. But we started by turning our attention to connections and health and really starting to value that part of your world to build it up. So when you say you want to have a day off or I want some time with myself or to spend with my family, usually the reason why you haven’t done it already is because the value of it isn’t as high as it needs to be able to compete with the demands of work or a phone ringing even. So can you remember connections and health? Where were you at? Just paint that picture. So we’ve said, all right, by the end of this we’re going to try and organise something that says you can have a day off a week or whatever it is. Where were you at with connections and health at that time?

Speaker 1 (23:30):

So my health was bad. I would say I was probably at the unhealthiest I’ve ever been at that point in time. And with connections I put so much back into the business, I started to build the relationships at home. And so through launch I fixed my connections at home, especially my kids with my wife. But then the back end of launch, I started to push to grow the business a bit more and I probably went back that full circle and went back and committed too much to the business and it caused a few issues in personal life then. So that was where I had to draw a line and say, Hey, I need to be able to step away from the business to fill the family cup essentially and be present at home without the phone ringing or work calling on me when I don’t want it to.

Speaker 3 (24:28):

Yeah, I think what it did is that goal that you set around time for yourself, it just threw something else on your plate, but it wasn’t that you were ever going to get more time because you’ve got all the time. There is already. It wasn’t that you could work any less diligently on the business and it wasn’t like the demands were going to shrink at home. So it wasn’t about how do I make things less, it was about how do I create what we said at the beginning, which is the balance and control in your world to be able to do all of these things and make all of these balls work, including looking after yourself.

Speaker 1 (25:00):

Definitely.

Speaker 3 (25:01):

And that’s no small task. I mean talk about your health for a minute. I mean we’ll come back to connections in a moment, but talk about health, where you’re at and what you were doing in terms of diet, exercise, sleep, what was going on at the time?

Speaker 1 (25:17):

Okay, so paint a picture. So I didn’t eat. I was eating one meal a day. I was probably having 10 beers every night, smoking a packet of cigarettes every day, exercise. If I didn’t get it on the job at work, it didn’t happen. So yeah, I wouldn’t say I was too healthy.

Speaker 3 (25:39):

And it wasn’t because you weren’t on site either. You were in the office working in the office, so it wasn’t like you had that option anymore. So it was a pretty different world and I think again, it took that commitment to go, I don’t necessarily know how, but I have to change. There was this sort of push from somewhere that said, this has got to be different.

Speaker 1 (25:58):

Yeah, it was. And I never felt that bad in my whole life. I’d never considered myself to be unhealthy or unfit even though I was living that kind of lifestyle. But at that point I realised that if I keep going like this, it’s not going to end good.

Speaker 3 (26:17):

Why did you have that realisation? What was it? As you said, you’ve lived that way your whole life and you never considered it to be unusual or unhealthy or anything like that. What caused you to have the realisation that it wasn’t going to be able to continue?

Speaker 1 (26:32):

I think it was more the change of work on the tools. You don’t have to worry too much about, you could rock up, be groggy the next morning and you can still put paint on the wall. Whereas I had to rock up and worry about where six blokes were going to work at that time and if I didn’t have my head on the game, then they’re hanging around saying, Frank, what are we doing today? And I’m still trying to shake off the beer from last night. So that’s the main thing really.

Speaker 3 (26:59):

So Frank, massive changes happening on the connections and health Legacy as we’re coaching through this leverage programme. What were you noticing as a result of being in there? Were you getting closer to the group, more into your coaching? What was happening around you at the time that you think influenced some of those decisions?

Speaker 1 (27:20):

So the deeper I dive into coaching, you meet and see more guys in the community and you see the blokes that have changed their lifestyle for the better, their health habits essentially, and the results of their producing on the back end of that. And they kind of gives you the drive and you say, well, if they can do it, why can’t I? And that was probably the first trigger for me that made me say my health habits or my lifestyle is not going to guide me or not serve me anymore and I need to make a change.

Speaker 3 (27:53):

I love that and I think that’s a real good lesson for anyone is when you look around to peers or people that you are involved with being able to take inspiration rather than just play a comparison game and you’ve never, I don’t think I can remember a time, I don’t know Rob, I don’t think we’ve ever had to have the comparison conversation with Frank at all.

Speaker 2 (28:13):

No, I’d agree. And I think what Frank’s done really well is that he put himself into that environment and instead of looking at people in the coaching community and being threatened by them, he looked at the coaching community for inspiration to be able to go, well if they can do it, so if they can do it, so can I. And we saying coaching all the time, success leaves clues and I think Frank just kept picking up those clues to be able to go, well, if I eat better and eat more and train more and fix up my diet and quit smoking and all those types of things, then I will change my life. And then if I change my life, look what this does to my business and my relationships. So I think you’re able to connect the dots instead of playing comparison, you connected the dots and that’s what you did exceptionally well during that time. So talk us through some of the changes, mate. Talk us through some of the big changes you did make on the health front.

Speaker 1 (29:05):

I started eating three meals a day. I started swimming, started off at one morning a week and then went to two, which was hard. It’s hard to get up, but I did it through the smokes away, no more drinking on school nights and then on the back of that now I pretty much barely drink. My relationship to alcohol has completely changed and they’re the four big things that have changed my I’m the fittest I’ve ever been and the healthiest I’ve ever been.

Speaker 3 (29:35):

Yeah, you’re looking good these days, that’s for sure. What was the heart, I mean again, I smile now because we went through this journey coaching you through it together, but I remember talk us through what it was like to have three meals a day for you because as you listen to this, you’ve got no idea what it was like for Frank to go from not eating to having three meals a day.

Speaker 1 (29:58):

It was just something that I’d never done. I just woke up, I had a coffee, went to work, that was just what I did. So it was a full lifestyle, 360 for me and I had to force myself to eat and started off a piece of food in the morning, handful of nuts and lunchtime and just slowly building on that, the round table at the time, my round table really gave me a nudge and help me to account, which helped me along the way to get to that point. Yeah, so it sounds silly now talking about it, but yeah, that’s where I was.

Speaker 2 (30:34):

It’s so good you came into coaching to be able to, because you knew you had twins on the way and you were working crazy hours, but who would’ve thought you came into coaching and you completely changed your relationship with alcohol, quit smoking, started eating better and exercising and exercising regularly during the week. And this is the benefit that we see from coaching from our holistic approach, that it’s not just hard-nosed business strategies. We touch on each area around health, wealth, business and connections to be able to create an amazing life for the client, not just create a great business and what a crazy outcome. You came into coaching for one reason and you got that, but look at what you’ve done from a health point of view to make you think that you’re the healthiest you’ve ever been. It’s pretty inspirational, mate. You’ve done an incredible job.

Speaker 1 (31:27):

Thanks man. On the back of that you, you’re feeling healthier. So then you become the role model to your kids and you’re leading the kids’ life. I’m a better role model for my children and for my family and it all links in together. All four pillars do link in and it’s a whole lifestyle change, this coaching.

Speaker 3 (31:49):

And I think that’s the thing. Once you lock in that higher value to it, you can become an inspiration or example to your kids and you can create generational change as we call it, by changing some of these relationships and building up the energy you need to be present as a dad. All of this sort of stuff, these things they’re challenging to do and go through, but it’s not hard. You do them willingly, you do them with excitement. Your attitude towards making change is completely different than if you would’ve just said, I’m giving up drinking, I’m giving up smokes, Jesus, what sort of life is this going to leave me with? It’s a completely different way of doing it. And you never once complained, you never sort of raced through it. You just did it methodically and properly, but you never lost sight of why you were doing it, which was really, really important.

Speaker 1 (32:34):

Yeah, definitely. And it’s all about the why. If you don’t have the why, you’re not going to be able to get or to do what you have to do to get the result.

Speaker 3 (32:43):

Awesome. So I’m going to go forward here to the end of leverage. Now let’s talk about when we get to the end of leverage, or maybe Rob you want to explain this, but what do we do at the end of leverage? We start talking about visioneering. Do you just want to describe quickly what Visioneering is? Because Frank had a pretty good visioneering experience, but then what happened after that was even better?

Speaker 2 (33:03):

When you’re running a business that’s sub million dollars, you don’t necessarily need a lot of big vision to get you there. It’s just tactically being able to run this business. But once you get to a certain point of in business, especially when you’re ready to turn that corner and build a business greater than you and build a lifestyle business that we call it, you got to have vision when you’re early in your journey, you’re motivated by pain, but short-lived vision is about finding pleasure and working towards that and striving for something that you want to build and create that internal drive. And so at Pravar we call it to play on words engineering your vision, and it’s your ability to be able to look forward and create picture that thing in your life of what you want to strive towards. For most people in the trades construction space, they already do it well, especially those in the building game. They can already see a house being built in their mind before they even build the house. And so visioneering is no different. It’s your ability to paint that picture in your mind of how you want to live your life across the health, wealth, business and connection legacy. So visioneering is a very important part of a client’s journey. Once they get to the end of leverage, that really propels ’em forward from inspired from within to want to make real change rather than just being motivated by paying all the time.

Speaker 3 (34:31):

Absolutely. And I think what that reveals out of their vision is the next step of growth, which is usually in leadership and management skills. That’s sort of what we see as the next leap forward as you go from leverage programme at Pravar into lifestyle. So Frank, we’ll talk more about management and leadership at that moment. And without giving the game away, can you remember what the primary focus of your visioneering experience was? What were you sort of thinking about at the time as you were going into this third chapter of your journey?

Speaker 1 (34:59):

Yeah, I definitely can. So by the end of leverage, I could have a day off work. So that was that box ticked. And then my next big thing and my vision was to be able to go on a family holiday to Italy later on that year for our 10 year anniversary.

Speaker 3 (35:15):

Yeah, I think it was just on 12 months or just over 12 months away.

Speaker 1 (35:21):

It was eight months away.

Speaker 3 (35:22):

Eight months away. Sorry. I always overestimate You’re always on the shorter end. I’ve got to remember that. I should know that by now. Eight months away. So eight months time, you’re going to go from just starting to have you one day a week fishing and then going into this family trip. And it wasn’t a small trip either. It was the 10 year one, it was like weeks and weeks away you wanted to have.

Speaker 1 (35:41):

Yeah, so it was a six week holiday.

Speaker 3 (35:43):

Six week holiday. And had you ever had a six week holiday before?

Speaker 1 (35:46):

No, I hadn’t had one in 10 years.

Speaker 3 (35:48):

All right, so another no precedent challenge that you’ve set for yourself in eight months, I’m going to go away for six weeks and we’re going to get this done. Now let’s talk about what happened in between. So you’ve set the vision, you’ve done all of that sort of stuff, management and leadership. So now you have to be confronted with the point of view of I’ve got the ground crew, I’ve got the support around me, I need the leaders around me to be able to take on and manage this business. So what did that mean to you when you sat down and you said, all right, let’s plan this out. What did you think about who has to step up? How do I have to lead them? What was going through your mind?

Speaker 1 (36:24):

We sat down in coaching, we worked out that we had to have someone to run all the jobs, an ops manager, and we needed a second admin in place in the office and on the back. So to do that, we had to get a second office space that could essentially hold the people to be working out of it because our original office by this stage had become a warehouse. So yeah, that were the three main things that we worked out that had to be done for me to be able to go on that holiday. So yeah.

Speaker 3 (36:55):

What allowed you to do that then? So you did go ahead, right? You put laws into structure, you started to train people. How did you feel about stepping up again yourself talk in terms of the leadership you had to find within yourself in the business rather than just relying on your skillset or your trade? What was the big challenge for you in terms of a leadership perspective, do you think?

Speaker 1 (37:17):

Yeah. Well, I had to stop managing, so I had to stop managing the day-to-day operations of the business because if I didn’t, then my phone would constantly be ringing and I know what’s going on in the job, so I have to become that leader to lead my managers essentially to give them the capacity and the capability to be able to run the jobs without me being there. So that was the biggest lever that I had to pull, and that was the hardest thing to do.

Speaker 3 (37:46):

What was hard about it? What was the biggest challenge in doing that that you found when you tried to step up another gear from making sure you’re across everything to now leading everyone.

Speaker 1 (37:56):

Then you’re really letting go. You’re really letting go of your baby, which gives you the freedom. And looking back now is the best thing I’ve ever done in business, but at the time I’m hand handing the reins over to someone and I’m trusting them with everything or a couple of people, which was a massive mindset or a thing for me. But it was great. It was hard, but great.

Speaker 3 (38:24):

For someone that’s about to go through that that might be listening, what would you say to them in terms of what would be a way to approach that, a mindset that you took into that? How would you advise someone to let go? It’s great, and that’s the outcome. When it works, it’s great. But what do you think is the key that you’d give us in order to do this properly is that you tell us.

Speaker 1 (38:48):

The key is to have the vision and the why. If I didn’t have to get away, if I didn’t have the vision to go on that holiday, I would never have allowed myself to hand over what I had to hand over to give me that holiday and that time with my family and everything that comes with it. So it was all about the why and the vision, which drove me to make those calls in business to give me the freedom.

Speaker 3 (39:18):

And was it something that you felt like, and this is interesting, right? We talk about letting go and guys can misinterpret this. We see it all the time, Rob, where guys go, all right, I’ll let go. Here’s the keys, off you go and bedlam and choose, right? Or there’s the idea of I’m going to train you and I’m going to do it properly. So did you invest in the training of people or was it just the hands off, I’m going to let it go and we’ll just roll the dice and see what happens?

Speaker 1 (39:43):

So over them eight months, I trained up until the last day. So it was small steps bit by bit, getting the systems and the process in place that they could, getting my business to a point where it ran at that point and training my team on how it runs essentially. And I built it with them and they were on board as well. They wanted me to go away. They wanted to take on the responsibility, but as a team, we got the business to a point over that eight months where I could step away.

Speaker 3 (40:15):

And I think Rob, that’s an important point, isn’t it? The fact that there’s a difference when we say you’ve got to let go or shed to grow as we call it, there’s a real way to do that properly and there’s a real way to almost guarantee failure and going backwards.

Speaker 2 (40:28):

Yeah, there’s two ends of the spectrum. There’s the micromanager, the person who never lets go because they micromanage the shit out of everything. There’s the other end of the spectrum, which is the complete hands off manager, which is like, here, I’m just going to relinquish control and let go all together. But I think there’s that balance in the middle, which was what Frank was talking about before, where you do relinquish control, but you maintain a sense of control and you have the right checks and balances and systems and processes in place to be able to have control over things as you do relinquish control. And so I think what Frank did really well was find that middle ground. He knew he couldn’t, the only way to get away and go on holidays was to not micromanage the day-to-day. He didn’t want to go to the other end of the spectrum, which was just completely, Hey, here’s the operations, off you go.

(41:17):

He found the middle ground nicely, got clarity on the role, got the right person in there, built the systems and processes with them and train the hell out of them and had the confidence that they were the right person in there. And that’s what Frank did exceptionally well. And that’s what gave Frank the confidence to be able to go, right, I’m out. I’m going on holidays with my family. Without that, even though you’ve got someone in the role, you never have the sense of confidence and freedom to be able to step away. And I think Frank, you did a really good job there, didn’t you? Where the right position, right person, right training, you had confidence and off they went.

Speaker 1 (41:52):

Definitely the confidence in giving. I had the confidence in him that he could do the job that I’d given him, and I was holding the right amount of control in my business that it wasn’t just a free for all. Off you go. So definitely.

Speaker 3 (42:12):

Yeah, you did a great job with that mate. Now I suppose if you’re listening, you can follow along here, but let’s fast forward to, you did actually go on this trip and you actually have had that experience of having your vision from eight months ago when we’re in visioneering actually come true. Do you want to just tell us quickly about the trip you actually went on and where you went and what you did?

Speaker 1 (42:33):

So this is on four kids. We went to Italy for six weeks, top to bottom. It was an amazing experience, something that I never thought possible, and it’s crazy to think eight months ago I wanted a day off work, and then here I am with one or two meetings a week on the other side of the world and my business is running. It was a surreal feeling. It’s crazy.

Speaker 3 (43:01):

And let’s contrast that. Like I said, we’re going to talk around where you started to where you’ve been and all the things you’ve done to build this balance and control and order in your life. How many phone calls, what’s the phone doing these days?

Speaker 1 (43:14):

The phone doesn’t ring, so my old number is now part of the business. I’ve got a new number. Not many people get it. The only people that on my phone does not ring essentially, unless it’s family or friends, it doesn’t ring. When I’m at work, I’m at work. When I’m at home, I’m at home.

Speaker 3 (43:34):

So that separation’s held. What’s your focus at work at the moment? What’s your primary role in the business and how clear are you on what you need to do to steer this ship in the future?

Speaker 1 (43:45):

So at the moment now, I don’t have nothing to do with day-to-day operations as far as running the jobs. I’m a selling gm, so my role essentially is to make sure there’s work coming in and new avenues of work with that. So I’m expanding the business into other revenue streams and then also supporting my managers and my team to make sure that they have what they need to succeed.

Speaker 3 (44:08):

Brilliant. I love it. How are you continuing with your health pillar?

Speaker 1 (44:14):

Yeah, I’m continuing with my health pillar. So like I said before, I’m the healthiest I’ve ever been. I’m continuing to set myself new goals and essentially better myself every day.

Speaker 3 (44:27):

Still eating three meals a day.

Speaker 1 (44:29):

Still eating three meals a day, still doing a bit of exercise.

Speaker 3 (44:32):

And still getting plenty of fishing in no doubt.

Speaker 1 (44:34):

Plenty of fishing in.

Speaker 3 (44:36):

I love it. And relationships with the kids.

Speaker 1 (44:40):

Yeah, home life and relationships is the best that’s ever been in my whole life, so I can’t complain there.

Speaker 3 (44:47):

So amazing. Now there’s one pillar we haven’t touched on, which is what we call our wealth pillar, which is how you start to move beyond just what you’ve been doing and starting to accumulate or build wealth. Anything you’ve got in that area, I know there is, so why don’t you tell us just a tiny bit about what plans you’ve had or what you’ve put in place in that pillar as well in the journey that we’ve been on.

Speaker 1 (45:09):

So part of my vision last year, I did have a bit of a vision for wealth, which was to start to invest to create a bit of a legacy going forward and get my family into a bigger family home. And we’ve just achieved both of those things. So we’ve moved out of our home into another one and we’ve just bought an investment property and a few shares and a few other bits and pieces going on. So yeah, ticking that box to.

Speaker 3 (45:34):

It’s pretty good. It’s pretty good. And it’s not just ticking the box mate, you’re now living that life. This continues. It’s not like you’ve done it, tick the box and I can put that to bed. You are committed to each one of those pillars you’re still actively working on. It’s not like you’ve ticked the box and sort of put it aside. You are conscious around where that is all the time.

Speaker 1 (45:52):

Definitely. And I live by it. I every day attend to all four pillars at some, I touch all four pillars every day of my life.

Speaker 3 (46:01):

And you can see that, and it’s paying dividends in that consistency that you’re building. If I was asking you now to go all the way back to when you heard that first call with Rob and you were able to give yourself some advice or Rob said, Hey, I’ve got someone here who’s just done an amazing job, smashed it out of the park, just have a chat to him, what would you like to tell yourself if you could go back into that first day? Believing the system?

Speaker 1 (46:27):

I had doubt and I did believe, but I did have doubt. So yeah, just follow the system and go with the flow and enjoy the ride. I think sometimes there’s always them hard parts of the journey and you think, fuck, what am I doing? But at the end of the day, you just got to enjoy every moment of it because it just makes it so much better when you get to the other side.

Speaker 3 (46:47):

Awesome. And what would you say about coaching at Pravar in general and more about the community in terms of now where you find yourself in lifestyle, when you’ve got this community around you that’s pretty much buzzing and vibrant, what do you take out of that? What does it mean to you to be part of that now as you’ve gone through all three programmes?

Speaker 1 (47:05):

It’s a special thing. It’s a special thing to be part of the Boys of Legends. I’ve got mates for life in here now that I would never have met before. I wasn’t for this. And the community, it just drives you. There’s no secrets. And if you’re having a bad day, you put your hand up and say, guys, I’m struggling here. And there’s always someone there to answer the phone or give you a kick in the ass, whatever you need to get you moving in the right direction. And it works the other way on the reverse of that as well. So it’s something that in my whole life, I’ve never had anything like this and it’s a pretty rare and special thing.

Speaker 3 (47:47):

Absolutely. Well mate, I’ve spent a lot of time with you through those three programmes, having been fortunate enough to coach you through most, all three of them. From my perspective, I’ll leave the last word to Rob, but I’ve really enjoyed the journey. You’ve absolutely smashed it and been a pleasure to coach, and I can’t wait to see what your next vision is when we sit down in January and we get to do it all again. I can’t wait to see what you do in order to make that one come true as well. But from behalf of me, thanks mate. It’s been awesome to be part of that journey and sharing it. And Rob, anything else you want to add as we wind this one up?

Speaker 2 (48:21):

Yeah, I think what I really love about Frank’s journey is that he, like he said before, he just trusted the process and did the work. He didn’t doubt he just did. And I think that’s what Frank’s been able to do in just under three years. Sometimes takes people five years or more to be able to achieve that level of balance and order across their life. But Frank’s been able to progress that from launch into leverage into lifestyle and achieve some amazing things going from 80 hours a week down to 30 that he is at the moment working. And to be able to have a couple of guys around him to, I think it’s a dozen guys around you now, for you to be able to have such a big growth in business and such a reduction in team, and then have all that balance and order across all four primary legacies.

(49:16):

The secret has been he hasn’t doubted, he’s just doubted. He’s just done it and just put in the work. And that’s what I admire about you mate. And every time you’ve taken a step forward, you’ve known why you want to do it, and you just trusted the process. And I think there’s a lot to be admired about that. And people could look to you for inspiration. They can, because they can learn a lot about what you’ve done. And if someone applies half as much as you’ve done, they’ll also change their life. So mate, from us, it’s been a real pleasure to coach you because you’ve just been such a great client who’s just got on with a job. And so never stop reaching for the stars mate, because you’re destined for great things and you’re really only just begun. There’s so much more that you can conquer. So yeah, keep up the great work mate. You’re doing a ripping job.

Speaker 1 (50:05):

Thanks guys. I couldn’t do it without you guys either. The whole used to all the cages and the community, it’s all part of it. And you guys have put me where I, I’ve done the hard work, but you guys have helped me get to where I am as well, so appreciate it.

Speaker 2 (50:21):

Absolute pleasure.

Speaker 3 (50:22):

You’re welcome mate.

Speaker 2 (50:23):

Well, boys, I think we might leave it there. What an incredible story of creating balance and order across all four primary legacies has been an absolute belter. And hopefully you’ve enjoyed today’s episode. We’ve got two more episodes coming for the remainder of this year, so make sure you keep your ears peeled for them. And if you are looking to make some amazing change in your world, just like Frank has, don’t be afraid to get a call booked in and let’s jump on a call early in the new year or in quarter one. In the new year when you get back and looking forward to talking a bit about where you’re at and where you’re trying to go. And let’s put a bit of a plan in place for you to be able to see if we can help you out as well when timing is right for both of us. So looking forward to chatting to you then. Hopefully you’ve enjoyed today. Please make sure you take a leaf out of Frank’s book and take the lessons from today and execute like a champion and just trust the process. Great to come to you today Frank. Thanks very much again mate, and looking forward to coming back to you next week with another cracking episode of The Trade Den Podcast. Thanks team.