Episode 73 Podcast Transcript
Speaker 1 (00:00:00):
The bigger the business grows. It’s not like, oh, you’re going to get to this point and geez, business is going to be so easy. Business gets harder and harder the bigger it gets, but you develop personally and you get better and better at dealing with the hard.
Speaker 2 (00:00:16):
Hi everyone. Rob Kropp and Dan Stones here from Pravar Group and welcome back to another episode of The Trade Den. Welcome back, Dan. Good to have you here.
Speaker 3 (00:00:24):
Great to be back. Rob. Hi everyone. Really looking forward to today. We’ve got another client story to bring you, and today we’re talking to Matt Ryan from MTR. Good day, Matt, how are you?
Speaker 1 (00:00:34):
Afternoon fellas. I’m well. Hope you guys are too.
Speaker 3 (00:00:39):
Yeah, we’re always. Well mate, great to have you on board. We’ve been waiting for a while to talk to you, so really looking forward to getting into your story today and learning a little bit about your journey. It’s been a great one. We’ve both been intimately involved with it, I think it feels like for a long time now, but it’s one that we’ve really enjoyed and coaching has been a ripper, so looking forward to pulling it apart and reliving some of the high points and maybe the not so high points.
Speaker 1 (00:01:04):
No, it should be good guys.
Speaker 3 (00:01:05):
Looking forward to it. All right. As we usually do, let’s just camp out for a bit. Let us know a bit about yourself, where you’re based, family, things you like to do, that sort of thing. We’d love to get to know you a bit more.
Speaker 1 (00:01:16):
Look, we’re both down on the Mornington Peninsula in Melbourne. I’ve got a family, I’ve got a wife, I’ve got three boys, seven, five, and three. So life is pretty chaotic at home. Business is based around sort of high end domestic, ultra high end domestic I guess as well as as a little bit of service work and a little bit of small commercial.
Speaker 3 (00:01:37):
Excellent. Very good. And I cannot believe Mitch is seven. That’s crazy.
Speaker 1 (00:01:43):
Yeah, growing like a weed as well.
Speaker 3 (00:01:46):
Absolute madness. Are you up to coaching footy and all that sort of stuff yet or is it Yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:01:50):
Yeah, all of that’s going on mate. So yeah, weekends are all now just kids sports. Yeah,
Speaker 2 (00:01:55):
Three boys. They must keep you and Katie’s hands very busy home.
Speaker 1 (00:02:02):
Yes, there’s some nights I get home and yeah, she hands me the three boys and says I’m out. But no, all good. Love it.
Speaker 3 (00:02:10):
Yeah, the tap out comes for everyone at that stage. They can’t wait, so you’re doing well if you’re looking after that and doing all that other stuff, it’s great to see. Awesome to see. Mate. Let’s get stuck in a little bit then into your journey with us. And I really want to camp out here. We don’t usually do this, we usually jump into the coaching journey and all that sort of stuff, but what was life like for you before you started MTR? Did you do trade first? What was the background in terms of your, I suppose working life or where did you start off?
Speaker 1 (00:02:42):
Okay, so I finished school, I had six months off and I did a pre-apprenticeship, did a little bit of travelling with some mates and just played up as you usually do when you finish up school. And then I started my apprenticeship and I literally did my apprenticeship, finished and started my own business literally the next week. Yeah, it was a bold move. Dunno if I’d do the same thing again or advice. It’s a good idea, but you think you know everything, so just jump straight in.
Speaker 3 (00:03:10):
That is a bold move. I love that. This could be the title of the podcast, Matt Ryan, A bold move. That’d be cool. Where was the six months travel, what did you do and did you go, you went with mates? Katie wasn’t on the scene then?
Speaker 1 (00:03:21):
No, Katie wasn’t around, just played up. It’s a good way to put it.
Speaker 3 (00:03:27):
Anywhere in particular or just from the moment you got to the airport to the moment you got home and you can’t remember?
Speaker 1 (00:03:32):
No, just places around mate. Bali, Thailand, all that sort of stuff. Didn’t really do the whole European thing around Australia, all that sort of stuff. So yeah, just a bit of fun really for six months. Yep.
Speaker 3 (00:03:43):
Excellent. So when did this journey of pre-apprenticeship apprenticeship starting the business whirlwind, when did Kay, you come on the scene?
Speaker 1 (00:03:50):
You know what? I met my wife when I was about a third year apprentice. Yeah, A bit of a night out in Bendigo, but that’s a story for another time.
Speaker 3 (00:04:00):
Another bold move, was it?
Speaker 1 (00:04:02):
Yeah, that’s it.
Speaker 3 (00:04:03):
I like it. Nights out in Bendigo. Good fun.
Speaker 1 (00:04:08):
But yeah mate, look, I started my business, look before I met you guys, I probably been in business about nine years, 10 years. So I spent a lot of time battling through a lot of learning curves, especially probably in the first sort of four to five years, especially being young and being a bit naive thinking that I knew it all. Yeah, there’s a lot of learning curves to start with.
Speaker 2 (00:04:32):
And why the electrical trade? Why did you get into the electrical side of things?
Speaker 1 (00:04:37):
At the time? I enjoyed electrical. I enjoy the challenge of it. And to be honest with you, I actually go back a little bit, I actually did a bit of a vcal thing for a builder back in the day and I worked with a chippy who was the most miserable bloke you’ve ever met in your life and it actually put me off being a builder and I came back to electrical and I really enjoyed it. So that’s sort of why I ended up in the electrical field.
Speaker 3 (00:05:03):
Awesome. And what was the initial sort of MTR? Who was the clients? Was it straight up domestic stuff? What were you into when you first started the business? Anything and everything you get your hands on.
Speaker 1 (00:05:13):
Yeah, look, when I first started it was anything that would come my way between real estate work, subcontracting to my old boss, subcontracting to friends bosses, the odd small owner builder job you could find got assigned up to high pages at one stage. That was a disaster. Whatever I could find mate, I’d do.
Speaker 3 (00:05:35):
Right. And was it just you when you set out or you had an apprentice or what was the crew look like?
Speaker 1 (00:05:40):
No, it was just me for probably the first 12 months. Yeah, probably about 12 months in. I actually, my old man went to semi-retire. So funny stories. I actually hired my old man as a mature age apprentice as my first apprentice.
Speaker 3 (00:05:57):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (00:05:59):
So he came back and he actually worked for me for three, four years. I think he pretty much got qualified and in that stage, look by the time he was at that stage we’d hired another couple more apprentices by then. So he got to a point about four years in, he’d sort of finished his time, he didn’t want to do it anymore, so he actually went back to retirement. We sort of went from there.
Speaker 3 (00:06:20):
Did he have any background in trade? If he’s done a mature age apprenticeship, he’s obviously picked it up as he’s just gotten into it.
Speaker 1 (00:06:26):
Yeah, look, my old man’s pretty clever like that. He picks up a lot of things pretty easily and he background God back in the day, he used to draw the power lines for the SEC when they used to hand draw ’em and then he was involved in computers and stuff like that before he jumped out of that and decided he’d come work for me for a bit.
Speaker 3 (00:06:45):
Wow. What was he like as an employee? This would be good. You’re going to have to play him this episode. What was he like as an employee?
Speaker 1 (00:06:51):
I’d say look, I admire my old man for putting up with me, especially back in those days because I’ve definitely had a temper in the past and could fly off the handle. And my old man’s very cool, calm, collected and he put up with a lot of my dummy spits in the early days.
Speaker 2 (00:07:09):
He would’ve been such a good foundation for you though as you went into business straight out of your apprenticeship and just having family, your dad around you, even though he was an apprentice, he was probably a good sounding board and just a good stabiliser in your world by the sounds of it.
Speaker 1 (00:07:25):
Yeah, a hundred percent mate. And he used to sort of calm me down and it was interesting, I used to turn up to clients’ houses and they would sort start talking to the old man and then the old man looking and go, nah, don’t talk to me, talk to him.
Speaker 2 (00:07:38):
Talk to the boss. I love it.
Speaker 3 (00:07:42):
That’s so good. We almost need to plan an episode with your dad. We’ll just get all the go as a follow up to this episode. This would be awesome.
Speaker 1 (00:07:51):
It’s funny because he’s still involved in the business now doing a bit of bookwork and just got access to the bank accounts and pays wages and stuff like that. So he sees a completely different aspect to the business now. So it’s been good. It’s good in a way that it gives me and the old man a good connection every week. There’s still a lot of contact between us, so it’s good from a family point of view.
Speaker 3 (00:08:12):
It would be good. I was about to say you must be good mates to go through all of that. I mean there’s business side and there’s family, but then you’ve got to have that ability to at least be able to work in the same space as each other. There’s got to be something going on there.
Speaker 1 (00:08:24):
Yeah, a hundred percent mate. And he still kicks around. He does a bit of bookwork for us now and he still kicks around in the factory now he’s got a factory full of tools. So he comes down and plays with these old cars and caravans and bits and pieces. Yeah, so no, it’s good. It sort of gives a common point of interest as well.
Speaker 3 (00:08:41):
Yeah. Awesome. I love that. That’s really cool. I didn’t know that. Alright, so let’s get into, you’ve been in business for a while, your dad’s resigned, he didn’t retire, he had to get out of it. He couldn’t handle the dummy spits anymore, we’ll call it for what it is. So we’ve gone through all of that stage obviously then we get to a point where coaching is, this is where we want to camp out this idea of what we’ve called or we’ll talk about as a million dollar sort of glass ceiling. You’ve got to a point where you’ve reached a certain level. So when you got to that point and sort coaching became around the corner, paint a picture for us in terms of what you were dealing with at the time, the customers you had, the challenges you were facing, just what was the scene on the ground at the time when you got to that point where you’re like, all right, we’re going to have to make some changes.
Speaker 1 (00:09:28):
So look mate, I’m a stubborn bastard at times. So I got to that point and it probably was another four years at that point before I finally actually approached you guys. So I went through all the classics like the win work do work cycle. You go through a year and you’d have a crack in year because you’ve busted your ass to win all this work. Then you busted your ass to do all the work and then next year you completely sucks because you haven’t won all the work because all you’ve done is do all the work and you’d go through that cycle of you’ve made a bit of money next year you’d be like, fuck, where’s it all gone and go through that cycle. So it was probably four years at that stage of $800k to a million in terms of turnover and you just your frustration of it and you’re going between you and maybe three or four apprentices, maybe a qualified or two to five or six, and then you pull back again because you’re having that downturn and you’ve lost the work. And I’m just stubborn mate. And I just went through that cycle for about four years before I finally decided I’d had enough.
Speaker 3 (00:10:29):
So obviously to do that you’ve got to be able to win the work as well as do it. So winning work was never a challenge for you. This wasn’t a growth thing. And Rob, maybe jump in and we can explain a bit more what we mean at this barrier, but it wasn’t a problem of not being able to get work or have work to go onto. You could actually get work, right?
Speaker 1 (00:10:47):
Yeah, correct. You could get the work and I could probably have gone out and gotten more work, but I didn’t know how you could manage more work, if that makes sense. I didn’t know how you could build a business to manage that work without me being across every aspect on site in the office, making sure that jobs are handed over properly and things are done properly, all that sort of aspect. You didn’t know how you could manage your quality control or do anything beyond that and that’s where you get stuck at that point. You just can’t get any further.
Speaker 2 (00:11:17):
What did a typical day in terms of hours and workload and responsibilities look like for you? Took us through a typical day, typical week type of thing.
Speaker 1 (00:11:26):
Sort of in those days. Look, I was still, I think by the time we’d got introduced to you guys, we’d got the warehouse where we are now. And I think I might’ve just got into the office here, so I might’ve had one day in the office, but then a workday was running around to sites, being on the tools, then maybe not being on the tools and going around and checking quality control or trying to hand a job over or trying to quote the next job or check the next thing out and look, I could start at six in the morning, I could finish at six at night. And you don’t think anything of it, it just becomes the norm. It just is what it is. It’s just what you’ve got to do. But it was always varied. I never had any real structure. Every day was just whatever was the most urgent you just jump on and that was it.
Speaker 2 (00:12:13):
And then in terms of workload after hours and weekends, how did that then bleed into those types of hours as well?
Speaker 1 (00:12:20):
Yeah, look, I was probably by that stage I wasn’t doing a lot of weekend work. Look, there was definitely some weekend work and what I was finding too was the weekend work I was doing was because I had to catch up on quoting or something of that and I needed the time where my phone didn’t ring at that stage my phone would ring 20, 30 times a day. Now I’m lucky if it rings five if that. But that was the issue was the Saturday morning quotes was the easiest time to quote because no one would ring me and I could sit down for four hours on a Saturday morning and do the equivalent of trying to sit down for 12 hours during the week worth of quoting and bits and pieces. So that’s probably where it bled into those Saturday mornings and then probably into getting into later nights, but always try to control it a little bit. But you’d sort of like I said, saying it was the norm for me to work 12 hours without thinking about it.
Speaker 2 (00:13:11):
You just got to do what you got to do to keep pushing ahead. And sometimes you’re flat out trying to win the work and then you just flat out just trying to get through the work. We call it the hamster wheels zone, literally just going round around a circles, aren’t you?
Speaker 1 (00:13:24):
Yeah, a hundred percent. Yep. Yep. And you hit that threshold and without building any more structure in your business, you’re never going to get any further, I don’t think.
Speaker 2 (00:13:34):
What do you mean by that, that you’re never going to get any further? How was that showing up for you on a day-to-day basis?
Speaker 1 (00:13:40):
Do you want to go back to the first introduction call Rob?
Speaker 2 (00:13:44):
How are you feeling? Talk us through what you were feeling, what you were thinking.
Speaker 1 (00:13:49):
Mate. I was pretty frustrated I think when I finally reached out to you. So I’ve done a couple of little things before I jumped on board with you guys or did that introduction call with yourself. And I still tell this story to people like how I got introduced to pr and I remember I got onto the phone call with you mate and I reckon I spent 45 minutes bitching about my business, how the trading industry sucks, there’s no money in it. All I’m doing is flug my ass off not getting anywhere. Employees suck and I was going to throw it away. I’ve had enough, if this doesn’t work, that’s it. I’ll go and develop, I’ll do something else, I’ll go and work with someone like whatever was going on. I reckon it was interesting on this call and we’re talking about this and you literally just called out all my bullshit literally on the call and you’re just called a spade, a spade. It was like, well, you’re bored, you’re lazy, you’re frustrated, you’re this, you’re that. And I remember just getting off the court just going, what’s one way to make a sale? You really sort of called me out on it and it really made me turn around and go, alright, well if I’m going to do this, I’ve got to be serious about it and I’ve got to change. I’ve got to make a change for the better for myself, my family, for everything else and what I’m doing. Otherwise I’m just going to get to a point where I’m burnt out and that’ll be it.
Speaker 3 (00:15:10):
So what did you see on that call, Rob, if you can remember it as well? We’ve just heard from Matt what he sort of experienced, but what were you seeing on that call when you heard him talking like that?
Speaker 2 (00:15:23):
I could see a guy who was extremely frustrated in the position that he was at, and as you said, it was the 45 minutes of venting and negativity, but that negativity was you’re not a negative person. It was just a, it’s almost like you had a platform to talk about what was really going on in your world with someone who was objective and it was just coming from a pure place of frustration. You were frustrated that you were going on this cycle over four years. You were frustrated that it was long days, you were frustrated, you weren’t moving your head. I remember you told me that there was times you’re going to grab your laptop and throw it out the window. You’re that frustrated. I think it was just coming from a pure place of feeling trapped, confused about what to do next and frustrated about the position you’re in. And that’s, but so many trades businesses owners don’t understand that this is a huge sticking point that every trades business gets to it around these $80k, $100k months that they hit this ceiling and they can’t break through and then they just sit there frustrated and less, like you said, Matt, you’ve got to make fundamental change. And I think you got to that point where it’s like, well if something’s got to change, I’ve got to make some massive fundamental wholesale changes to what I’m doing yeah?
Speaker 1 (00:16:42):
A hundred percent. And I think looking back on it now, I reckon a big part of that frustration was I wasn’t seeing any progress up to that point. The business sort of progress, we’d grown a bit, we’d grown a bit, we’d turn out a bit more money, we’d employed another person, we’d got a premises, I had progress each year and then we got to, to this point of for about four years, there was no progress. And I don’t like sitting still, I don’t feel like I’m not getting anywhere. And that was probably a big part of the frustration as well, looking back on it is I felt like I wasn’t, what am I doing all this for if I’m not moving forward?
Speaker 3 (00:17:18):
Did you think of, was the moving forward and where you were, was it not knowing what to do or was it literally I can’t do anymore? There’s a slight difference in that. What was it for you?
Speaker 1 (00:17:32):
It was almost both, mate. So one is I’ve never worked in a corporate environment. Look, I’ve never seen structure built out in a business before. I’ve never dealt with that before. So one is I had no idea how to move forward. I had no idea how to build any more structure into the business. I had no idea I could do the work. I knew how to do the work, I didn’t know how to do any of the backend. I didn’t know how to build out that structure. And it was that frustration and no progress in that point of view.
Speaker 3 (00:18:02):
So was that what you came to coaching looking for? Was the filling in of the, if we said business acumen, the management skills, the things like that, that’s what you were coming for? Or were you thinking maybe there’s another way to run an electrical business that I don’t know about to be able to become a better sparky or a better owner of a sparky business?
Speaker 1 (00:18:20):
No, I think just spot on. I was definitely coming to learn that corporate side, how to build structure, responsibility, chains of responsibility, how to alleviate a lot of the day-to-day tasks off my plate. Electrical comes naturally to me now, not so much now. I barely pick up the tools now, but that side of things, I just had no idea how to build it out and I didn’t have anyone around me too, which is probably a good point around me. I didn’t have anyone who had built that structure before who I could lean on. My parents haven’t owned a business or like that. I have don’t, didn’t really have a lot of people in my life that I could speak to openly about business to actually ask how the hell do I build structure? How do I build accountability? How do I get these guys to do to the quality that I expect and hold them accountable to it? I had no idea. And then it came down to numbers, then we could go right into the financial side of things. I’d started doing a little bit of stuff from the financial point of view before I met you guys, but not that much. And previously before that I did accounting in year 12 and I thought I knew how to run the numbers in a business. That was it. And that gets you to a point, but it doesn’t get you any further. There’s a whole nother side of business that you need to learn to grow.
Speaker 2 (00:19:44):
And I think that’s why we, at Pravar we call it the, there’s a glass ceiling and a million dollars. There’s a really ugly point between one and 1.5 million for a trades business. And it’s a common scenario that the mindset and the strategies that got you to a million is not the strategies and the mindset that get you beyond that. And I’m sure you’d agree, Matt, that just getting to that $800k to a million dollars was just pure grit, determination and muscle. You were just really muscling your way through, weren’t you?
Speaker 1 (00:20:14):
Yeah. Then you’re just onsite, you’re just punching it out and that only gets you to that point. In all honesty, I don’t think there’s too many guys that will get any much further than that with that same mindset and saying it’s God my, I’ve changed my mindset about three or four times now being involved with you guys as it evolves. But that mindset like saying it gets you to that point and that’s it. You really do just hit this wall and yeah, it’s sort of the end of the line.
Speaker 3 (00:20:44):
I’m glad you mentioned mindset, Matt, because as you’re talking, I’m hearing you say you needed the management skills, you knew you needed this sort of side of things, the business needed more structure around it, the corporatization if you like, of what you’re talking about. Did you have any indication or any feeling or awareness of what you needed to do personally? As you just said, you’ve changed your mindset three or four times. Did you have that self-awareness to go, shit, I’ve got to make some changes for me personally or was that still to come as you went down the journey?
Speaker 1 (00:21:14):
Yeah, look at that time, no, I’ll be very honest, yes, I’ve evolved a lot now and I’m sure my wife will tell you that too. But at that point, no, I didn’t think I needed to change my mindset. I just needed to build this structure in the business. Yep. It’s a complete flip once I got involved as to how the business should grow, but also how I tackle that from my own personal perspective. Yep.
Speaker 3 (00:21:42):
Yeah, it’s an interesting one. I think everyone that comes to Pravar finds that out. And for you obviously you go, you’ve had the call with Rob, we know the situation you’re in, we’ve got a good understanding of all that. You jump into this programme called Launch. What was your initial reaction to that? Was it like, who the hell are these got? Why are these guys so messed up? Got it all together, I’m just looking for this extra bit or were you like, oh hang on, I do need to change. When did that sort of realisation happen?
Speaker 1 (00:22:10):
Look man, I’ll tell you what. So I jumped on just before Christmas in two years ago, three years ago, I can’t remember now mate. Anyway, and I remember having the call with Rob and he’s like, okay, you’re going to start fresh in January with us, et cetera. And he goes, but we do the January launch day and you need to come to the dinner the night before and then come to the launch day on the Sunday. And I was like, okay, no drums. I remember ringing Rob back and going, look, I’ll come to launch day on Sunday, but I’m not coming to dinner. I’m not going to dinner with 30 random blokes. I’ve got no idea. I don’t know anyone from bar. So mate and Rob goes, no non-negotiable mate, you’re coming to dinner. I was just like, in the end he sort of talked me around to it and I’m glad he did.
(00:22:48):
So we sort of did the dinner and you meet a bunch of these guys and you did the launch day. And I remember the launch day, one of the biggest impacts that had on me on launch day was listening to some guys in lifestyle. We talk about the Wilsons and a few of those guys and listening to their stories and having guys, I say grown men, I’m a grown man too, have these guys in front of you and be so open and honest and talk about their business. But also the entire day was everyone was very open and honest about their business and you realise that everyone’s going through the same problems. You’ve got mates that tell you how good their business is and everything’s flying mate, and I’m humming and I’m buying new cars and rah rah, and you think, what am I doing wrong?
(00:23:28):
And then you talk to these guys and guys are doing well, some guys are struggling, but everyone’s got the same problems and it’s about how we tackle those problems and how we deal with them. And you sort of listen to these guys in lifestyle and I remember just my mind just blowing these guys at the front telling these stories. Some pretty open stories too. I won’t say what their stories were, but the stories they think of how open and honest they were with us and then talking to them about business and how open and honest they were about their business. And I actually remember going back and saying to my wife, alright, I mean this is amazing. I’ve never seen grown men talk this way before. So no, it was good.
Speaker 3 (00:24:08):
So that opened you up to the journey that was ahead. You had to have that realisation that hey, there’s more to this than a bunch of strategies. There’s more to this than a bunch of silver bullets that are going to show up at the right time for me to grow this business. There’s probably a little bit more to this that needs to happen. And I think that then shows up as we go through launch. I think if we look back and we sort of go, all right, well we’ve got through all of that, the first thing we sort of started to tackle or run up to was the capacity that you had to continue doing what you did. So looking at trying to put a bit of team and a bit of support around you in terms of getting some of the low value tasks, the LVTs off your plate and admin. That was sort of our starting point to go, alright, let’s do this as a bit of a project and see how it goes. Now I was there week by week for this journey so I can fact check you on this, but what was that to you and how did it feel as we started to talk about, alright, well let’s pull a lever and let’s see what could happen, especially in this area of LVTs and admin.
Speaker 1 (00:25:07):
Yeah, a hundred percent. Going through the course admin was one of probably the first big levers that I did. And like you said, Dan, you were there on all those Q & A calls as I complained about how am I going to afford this? What is she even going to do or or she, I don’t have any tasks for them. And then we went through the hiring process and then I stood on that and I spent three months mucking around with that until you kicked me up the ass again. And then we could talk about how I hired someone and I actually still remember this. I hired them and it must’ve been June long weekend and we were going away and they were supposed to start the Monday after the June long weekend and they rang me on the Friday and said, they’re pulling the pin.
(00:25:47):
I was just like, oh, this is ridiculous. And we went around again and I got another admin and she was a cracker and she was really good. I think she was around for about three months and then she wanted to move on. She had a few other things going on that she had to go deal with and now I’ve got my current admin and she’s just unbelievable. And now my business wouldn’t run without her. It’s ridiculous. The amount of work that she does in the background and tasks that she’s taken off my plate is unbelievable.
Speaker 3 (00:26:19):
You’ve done well, you haven’t sugarcoated it yet, but we’re going to go a little bit deeper, but that is all true. It was three goes at it before we sort of got to where we are now in terms of that. But in terms of the time we went through, you talked about then the things that came up for you. You knew intellectually that it made sense in a way intellectually, it was like, I get it, admin does this, they have these roles that happens. What was really going on though as we went through this for you, when we started this process, what was telling you, can I afford it? For instance, let’s walk through these one by one, but can I afford it as a reason to sort of rub up against this and go, hang on, is this the right thing to do? And almost second guess or push back. Where did that come from?
Speaker 1 (00:27:06):
I guess because at the time you’re looking at what your business is doing and you’re going, well, where do you find another five or $600 a week for a part-time admin? Where does that money come from? And you’re at that point going, well, you’re struggling to make money as it is now, where are you going to find that money? But it’s the opportunity cost of not doing that is greater than the one of actually paying the money to start with and having that little bit of sacrifice to get it in place. And then you go through that cycle of, well what are they going to do? I actually dunno what this person’s going to do in my business. And you start to ride out some roles and you start to go, well they could probably file some plans, they could probably deal with this, they could probably deal with the car insurance. And you start to find some little things and you, oh, maybe they will be a little bit handy.
(00:27:52):
And I probably put that down a lot too to my first admin. And I actually remember a conversation with her about three or four weeks in, I started doing something and she was about to finish up for the day and she was saying to me like, oh okay, I’m about to head off. And I was like, no dramas, I’m just working through this. And she looks at me and she goes, why are you doing that? And I was like, oh, I just thought And she just looked at me and she goes, what am I doing here Matt, if you are just going to keep doing my job, send it to me and I’ll do it tomorrow. I was like, yeah, righto. Okay, sorry. But it was that whole letting go, letting go of a bit of control. It’s that first step to really getting low value tasks off your plate and letting go of that element that you have to do everything in your business.
Speaker 2 (00:28:35):
And that’s why so many trades businesses do hit that point that they can’t break through because you already had a couple of guys around you, you’d already fulfilled the first layer of leverage, which was a couple of a tradesmen, couple of apprentices, but it’s not until, and that’s what gets you to a million dollars. But to get beyond that, it’s building the operational structure, which is bookkeeping and admin and eventually a PM and all those types of things. And all of a sudden you’re hiring people that you have never hired before. You’ve never fulfilled that role formally. You’ve never been in a corporate environment like you said you that means relinquishing control. That’s looking back, that’s the thing that was keeping you stuck, wasn’t it? Because you almost became such a bottleneck in the business, weren’t you?
Speaker 1 (00:29:21):
Oh mate, I was 100% a bottleneck. I mean I could tell you now that I still bottleneck certain elements of my businesses as we try and grow it now and I’ve got to see that and recognise that and let that element go. But going back to those days a hundred percent and it’s that control issue. You are in business because you like control and you like to be, I don’t know, top dog is probably a bad word for it, but you take control of that element and so you’ve got to let go of elements of control within your business.
Speaker 2 (00:29:52):
And it’s hard to let go control and bring in more overhead when there’s no money to give, isn’t there? It’s almost like everything’s fighting against each other deep down. You’ve got to give something up and bring someone in. But it’s almost like the bank account’s saying no, this is all the conflict, isn’t it?
Speaker 1 (00:30:11):
Yeah, a hundred percent. It is literally that conflict in your head of going, why am I adding overhead to this business to bring someone in when the bank account, it doesn’t have that money necessarily there to be able, you’re looking at it at a long-term prospect and how’s that all going to work? When am I going to see the payback for this? It’s all those elements that really start to tie in.
Speaker 2 (00:30:37):
I really admire and Dan and I really admired your faith during that time. You put your faith into us to go and especially because it took a couple of goes to do it, you hired your first one, didn’t work out, hired the second one, she left for personal reasons. And then the third one, she’s still with you now and is the biggest asset to your business, but I really admire your faith during that time. But looking back, it was like most guys, when they take those first steps, it’s nerve wracking, it’s challenging. You’ve got to mentally have those breakthroughs to be able to push through. But it’s been one of the biggest levers you’ve pulled and it’s probably been one of the best ones from the early days, hasn’t it?
Speaker 1 (00:31:13):
Oh a hundred percent. Once you realise the benefit of what you’re going to get from getting an admin involved in your business, it’s huge and you accept that and then the development and the growth from that was really good. And then you sort of go, well, okay, I’ve done that once, so what’s the next lever to pull? I might look at putting a PM on now. And you start to pull different levers and you start to see the development and the growth that comes from that. It’s short-term sacrifice for long-term gain. It’s just getting that through your head in the first place.
Speaker 2 (00:31:47):
How did that admin person go from a day-to-day point of view to help you break that win work, do work cycle. So we’ve done a previous episode on this around the win work do work cycle as one of our earlier episodes and you were caught in that. But by getting that time back from the administrative grunt function, how did that enable you to then just go all in on sales and become sales led? What did that do from a mental capacity point of view, a time capacity point of view? How did that really help you push ahead from a business perspective and take off from there?
Speaker 1 (00:32:22):
Yeah, so it probably, well one you get a bit of time back, that’s probably the first big one. So once you’ve got a bit of time back, you can dedicate more time to quoting and then the mental capacity is a big one too. So once you relinquish that control and it allows you to free up that capacity in your head to then concentrate on more things and concentrate on more jobs, more quotes, getting more projects out the door, approaching more of the right clientele that you actually want to approach, that’s a big one. Instead of just relying I further, that’s probably another big factor of world load guys get to is they get to that million dollar stage and they just rely on their current scope of clientele, whether it’s builders or whoever that is to keep feeding them work. And I found that was definitely me as well. And you rely on those same guys to keep feeding you the same work and keep bringing the same jobs in. You’re not searching out more work, you’re not searching out more builders, you’re not searching out more clientele to develop more business relationships with and because you don’t have the time either. But as you bring admin in and you get those tasks off your plate, you get that time back to actually work on those things.
Speaker 3 (00:33:34):
You do. I think this is a point, and this is what gave us the confidence to push you so hard because what was showing up a lot for you Matt, I dunno if you remember at the time was overwhelm, there was a lot of calls you’d just come on, I’m so overwhelmed. And it was like, okay, what are you overwhelmed about when we go through the same exercise, write this stuff out, get it out of your head, all the usual things that we coach on, but the overwhelm was the clue to say that’s what needs to happen next. Because everything you wrote down was usually I can’t get to what I need to get to because I’m busy doing this and how do I do both? And it was like, well you can’t at least by yourself. So getting in admin was going to take all that off the plate, free you up to get to this next stage, which is the business development and growing the business in the areas and the places you wanted to take it to. But that was literally the definition of the bottleneck. And if you’re listening to this and you’re thinking, geez, I’m always overwhelmed, it could be, and you need to come and do the strategy call with Rob to confirm some of this stuff, but overwhelms a really good indicator, not so much that there’s too much going on, you can’t do things, but it’s time to make a shift. And I think Rob, that’s something that people underplay a lot is what overwhelm teaches. Is it about where we’re at in the business cycle?
Speaker 2 (00:34:43):
Yeah, overwhelm is too much going on in your head and it’s a lack of clear strategy moving forward because when you’re overwhelmed it’s like, well do I do this or do I do this and do I do this? And it’s almost like you feel the weight of the world on your shoulders and as a result you don’t work on what matters. You work on the easy stuff to feel that sense of fulfilment that you’re moving ahead and it’s not until you get that clarity to be able to go, boom, I’ve got to cut through all that. All that stuff’s irrelevant. That’s my most important thing. And that moment of clarity, getting stuff out of your head, getting a clear direction to be able to move forward and then taking steps to make things a reality, that’s what eliminates the overwhelm and gets you having a breakthrough to be able to keep moving. And that’s what Matt did really well. He got it out of his head, had direction and started executing like a champion and the results started to flow.
Speaker 3 (00:35:41):
Yeah, it’s like being in a boat and it’s filling up with water. You need to get to the next shore or the next destination, but while you’re busy bailing out all the overwhelm and all that stuff, you’re not moving anywhere. So you’ve got to get that out and then you can start rowing forward again, which is what Matt did.
Speaker 1 (00:35:54):
Yeah, a hundred percent. And that whole overwhelm concept is spot on. You get really overwhelmed in the business at that stage you’re in, you bring admin in, you get your time back, you develop your business a bit further, you get really overwhelmed trying to manage all your projects. So then you bring on a PM as I’ve gone through, you bring a PM on, so then you get a bit of time back and you go through that. Then one of the stages my PM just went through, he was really overwhelmed trying to be a PM across everything. So then we split his rollout. We’ve now got a PM and a service manager and you go through that overwhelm. I’m going through the overwhelm at the moment of quoting, so now I’m working on bringing an estimate. It’s a constant cycle in the business as you develop.
Speaker 3 (00:36:32):
Yeah, absolutely. And I think it is undervalued if you know how to deal with overwhelm, what it teaches you and what it uncovers. If you deal with it the right way or you coach through it the right way, it absolutely becomes a trigger point for something else other than holy shit, I’ve got to walk back from the edge of where I feel I’m at.
Speaker 1 (00:36:51):
Yeah, a hundred percent. And it’s having that coaching, I guess that person in your corner to sort of say why, how do we deal with this? Instead of you going, well bugger this, I’m going to go back to where I was comfortable. You go, okay, now I know what my path is forward. That’s what I’ve got to do over the next three, four months. And you bring that in and you move forward to the next step.
Speaker 3 (00:37:11):
Yeah. That became for you, that became as it does for a lot of people, you get that time back, it is going to cost you money. You’ve got to go out and you’ve got to win more work and do business development, which is where you went to, you became sales letters. Rob said the next thing that came up after this for you was that idea of aiming to please. You had that as when we got into moving forward into leverage. That was a big nail of yours was this, how do I overcome having to please people going out and talking to new builders and I’m trying to please everyone and do a really good job. I’ve got high expectations and all this sort of stuff, but we uncovered that as being a bit of a nail in terms of aiming to please. So as a little next chapter that sort of Matt, the nice guy, had to, that was probably your next phase of mindset was how do we go from being just Matt, the nice guy who knew his shit cold could get it done, but actually starting to be more strategic in your thinking that way.
(00:38:06):
So talk a little bit about aiming to please as a challenge for you that you work through.
Speaker 1 (00:38:11):
So you sort of go through that idea of I’ve got to keep every single person happy, every single client’s got to think we’re the best, we’re amazing. And you’ve got to get to that point where you need to understand that you’re a business too, because when you are trying to please everyone, it’s at the cost of your profitability. So you’ve got to understand that you’ve got to deliver a job and you’ve got to do what you say you’ve got to do. But there’s got to be a line in the sand too of not pleasing every single person or if you’re going to, you’ve got to charge ’em for it because then we can go into scope creep and all that sort of stuff and all those little extras that you do on the job to make everyone happy that you don’t charge for that. All it does is cost you on your bottom line.
Speaker 2 (00:38:53):
And that was a big part for you, wasn’t it really honing in clarity around the types of work that made money and charging accordingly and not being afraid for submission of variations and not being afraid to hold the line of them. That was a big part in your journey to really double down on your own worth and the business’ worth, especially in the really high end market that you’re in
Speaker 1 (00:39:21):
100% and it’s understanding your costs as well. That’s a big factor of, you get a lot of guys that go, oh, but I can have this done cheaper. And you go, that’s fine, I know what my costs are, I know where I’m at and I know what margin I need to maintain to maintain my business and I’m not going to be willing to take on this job and at the sacrifice of everything around me because that sacrifice also becomes your family as well because all of a sudden you’re not making money on those jobs. So now you’re sacrificing family time because you’re trying to keep building those jobs out and having that background to just push forward with the variations and not be scared about the price that you’re submitting or going, geez, I wouldn’t want to pay that. It’s not your problem if that’s the work and that’s the scope of work they want. It costs what it costs.
Speaker 3 (00:40:08):
So this evolution that we’re now hearing, remember we started off this with the million dollar barrier and the glass ceiling and all that sort of stuff. We’re talking about turnover at run rates at that point in terms of revenue, this next phase and getting into this is all starting to lean into profitability and your understanding of what it is to have a profitable business versus a business of a certain size. How did you feel going through that? And was this sort of the first time outside of your year 12 accounting that you did that you started to focus in on profitability at that level? And I’m keen to sort of explore what changed in you as a result of becoming profit driven rather than just turnover size or structurally driven.
Speaker 1 (00:40:51):
Okay, so look, I guess the profitability side of things, you get the idea that you should be profitable as a business owner. And I had a few things in place to try and manage that as well. But as you develop, I guess you learn more and more the amount of time that you put in, you need to be paid for your time and the sacrifice and the risk. So you start to learn more and more and you start to focus more and more, not so much on revenue but on profit. And you don’t have to be greedy, you have to be consistent and you just have to understand where you’re at. And I think that’s a lot of people’s problem is they don’t actually understand what’s profitable, what’s not profitable for ’em and where they sit on a certain job. So they sort of take massive cuts on project pricing and stuff like that just to get a project over the line. And they to find out in 6, 8, 12 months time, they’re completely losing money on it.
Speaker 3 (00:41:43):
Having clear boundaries I think was something that we worked on a lot. What are the boundaries you’re going to set up to be able to defend as you go through a job, not just negotiate against yourself all the way through a job and just let profit, dwindle, dwindle, dwindle, like you just said. Having the ability to understand that from the outset though, then it changed the way you did things. And we spent a lot of time talking about setting up jobs better, making sure expectations were absolutely clear what was included, what wasn’t included. So rather than quoting to include everything, it was like, all right, here’s option one, option two, option three, and things like that. And even looking to charge for design work and all those conversations we had, it was like your brain was like, all right, we’ve got to remain profitable. That’s our non-negotiable not to break through or have a structure or a certain business I’ve got in my head, but a business that whatever it becomes is at the very least profitable.
Speaker 1 (00:42:35):
A hundred percent. Because at the end of the day, you’re a business. That’s the idea of it, isn’t it? And I feel like as tradies you, that all goes out the window. It’s like buying stuff at tax time just because you’re like, oh, it’s a tax time sale. I need to reduce my tax. That’s going to be one of the worst things that’s ever been passed around. It’s understanding that and understanding where you’re at. And I’m not saying that every project we do is profitable, don’t get me wrong, we still get it wrong. We’re still learning, we’re still working through that. But the fact that we can review that and we can have live numbers that we can see consistently across our projects, we can see where we’re at on projects, we can see whether we’re making money, we can see where we’re losing money, we can see where we need to concentrate and maybe get through a certain section of a project just to get a certain unprofitable section out of the way or a profitable section in that we know we’re doing well on. So it’s having that understanding makes you so much more clearer in your business.
Speaker 2 (00:43:33):
By having that clarity and that understanding on your numbers. How does that make you a better leader, do you think?
Speaker 1 (00:43:40):
Gives me confidence. I know I can go, gives you confidence in terms of leader of going into negotiations because you know exactly what’s going on. You can sit there, I can do the calculations in my head when they come back to me and they want you to do it at a certain price and go, okay, well I know that’s X, Y, Z, a percentage of a haircut, but we’re still within a margin that’s acceptable for us. And in terms of a leader, it gives you confidence to make the calls that you need to make from a business point of view with your team and with structure and the way everything’s going, as well as looking forward with what structure you’ve got and what you’re going to require as the business grows.
Speaker 2 (00:44:21):
If you’re listening here today around what Matt’s talking around here is this is why so many trades businesses get stuck at that point because we say in coaching all the time, there’s two big skill sets that you’ve got to develop beyond a million dollars. It’s your management skills, which is your ability to structure a good business, put the right people in there and then develop systems around it. But the other side is really knowing your numbers intimately. And Matt, I know that the reason why you were frustrated because you didn’t know your numbers early on in the piece and you didn’t have clarity, you didn’t understand it, and you were probably like most trades businesses who looked at their accounts once a year with their accountant. But what you would’ve heard then with Matt was we look at every job, we know our price. If I do need to drop my pants, I know with it’s in a margin or I walk away.
(00:45:09):
And then he’s got live updates throughout the job. That’s strong financial management, which gives you the confidence and the clarity to be able to make good business decisions rather than just running this business with a blindfold on. And it’s almost chalk and cheese today compared to how you are running your business. And if you look at it, your emotions and the way you feel about your business is chalk and cheese to back then there as well. So this is the success that leaves clues is that if you want to run a great business, you’ve got to know how to manage people well, and you’ve got to know your numbers intimately. If you don’t, then you’re running your business blind, which is one of the most dangerous things that you can do in any time, but especially in today’s economy.
Speaker 1 (00:45:54):
Yeah, a hundred percent mate. And it’s understanding those numbers. And then you sort of said, you mentioned there about mindset, and we sort of touched on that back at the start of the episode, and I reckon that’s something that a lot of people don’t put enough value on is the way you approach stuff. So if you were to ask my wife now what I’m like when I get home from work, and again, don’t get me wrong, I still have my days where things don’t go. But in general, I come home, I’m relaxed, I’m a lot nicer to be around. Back in the day if I’d had a bad day, everyone would know that I’d had a bad day. And I remember having a conversation with my wife, I looked about three quarters of the way through launch, driving home from Bendigo, her folks live up in Bendigo, and we were sort of talking about what I’d been doing and stuff.
(00:46:38):
And she sort of said to me, she’s like, this is the best thing you’ve ever done for yourself, but also for the family. She’s like, the way that you come home now is so much more relaxed, just your demeanour compared to back then when you would come home angry and frustrated, annoyed and pissed off, and all of that would flow through every time you came home. You might be home but you weren’t home. Whereas now, I like to think more often than not when I’m home, I’m home and I’m relaxed and I enjoy the time with my wife and enjoy the time with the kids. And a lot of that comes down to the mindset that you sort of develop as you develop your business and develop through coaching.
Speaker 2 (00:47:20):
So good. What would she say about you now?
Speaker 1 (00:47:24):
What the good or the bad things are?
Speaker 3 (00:47:28):
So there’s two episodes. We’ve got Matt’s dad and Katie’s coming on after that, so we’ve got two more to go with this.
Speaker 1 (00:47:35):
Yeah, no, look, I’d say that she thinks that I’m probably a lot more relaxed now about business. I sort of mentioned this thing, things that would have say two or three years ago sent me through a loop or sent me to get frustrated and get angry and yell and all. Now I like a blip on the radar. You learn to deal with things a lot better and it’s just something major could happen and you just, instead of losing it, you just go, okay, see, how are we going to fix it now? What’s our approach guys? It’s happened. We can’t do anything about it. It is what it is, so what are we going to do to fix it? It’s that whole mindset and that attitude change around a lot of things, which is probably a bit of personal growth as well.
Speaker 3 (00:48:19):
It’s more than a bit, Matt. I think it’s more than that, and I think it comes out like where I said before about you wanting to please everyone and being a nice guy, I think you’ve learned how to hold onto those elements that you want to have. It’s not a negotiable that you have to give up being a nice guy or aiming to have a really good business that serves its customers well at the expense of profit, which I think that’s the mindset shift, what you thought you’d have to give up to get to this point versus what you’ve actually had to do have turned out to be two different things and the things that are coming through, even listening to you talk today, the calmness, the confidence, the fact that you’re still learning and you’re a nice guy. Still, none of that’s really changed, but you’ve changed immensely in terms of your outlook or your mindset in relation to these challenges as they come up. And I think that’s been a huge thing to know that you’re not going to lose yourself on this journey. The good parts of you can remain, even though you become a better businessman. It’s not all about being colder, it’s not about becoming more of a hard ass. There’s a side to this that you can integrate both sides of your life into the business that you end up running.
Speaker 1 (00:49:27):
And you’re spot on. It’s a lot of growth and I’ve still got a lot of growth to go. I feel, and that probably comes down to more personal growth, the business. Yes. But I feel like as you grow personally, your business will grow as well. It’s just development and again, it’s progression. I feel like no matter what I’m doing at the moment, I’m always progressing forwards, whether it’s in the business, the business might maintain at a certain level for 6 to 12 months, it is what it is, it’s stages that you go through, but you’re progressing personally as well and you’re developing as a leader and you’re developing as a better person to work for. Guys want to work with you, they want to be part of your team. They want to be involved in your business because of the way that you approach things and the way you go about it.
Speaker 2 (00:50:12):
I’m glad you make that comment, Matt, because Dan and I were only talking about this just earlier, that growing a business is one of the most challenging things that you will ever do. And business, the mechanics of business is actually quite easy. It’s winning work, money in money out, and there’s got to be more money left over, which is profit. And so there’s a lot of moving pieces when it comes to business, but the mechanics, the natural mechanics of businesses, quite easy. The hardest part of growing a business is your personal journey as the leader to grow this business. It’s fucking hard. It is the hardest because your leadership and your own development within yourself has to grow faster than the businesses growing. Otherwise you will become the greatest limitation to the business’s growth. I’m really glad you touched on that point, Matt, because that’s what we saw when you first started coaching is that you’d stopped growing, but the moment you started changing your mindset and having different open to new ideas and taking on new perspectives and learning new skills and your growth then accelerated and then business took off.
(00:51:29):
But hopefully you are seeing, and for you listening here today as well, that they go hand in hand. But that’s what makes business hard. It’s more of a personal journey than it is a business journey. And you’ve got to accept, if you are in business and you are stuck and you are not willing to do the work as an individual, then you may as well get out of the game because you’re never going to succeed in business. And I think Dan, it’s such an important thing to remember that business, the mechanics is hard, but it’s bloody hard because it’s such a personal journey to go on that journey that is business.
Speaker 3 (00:52:05):
Yeah, I think that acceptance that you’re not perfect. And I think Matt, not that you were saying you were perfect, but that idea which we were on a little while ago where you were sort of going, I thought it was everything else that had to happen. I thought I was pretty good and ready for this journey, but this is sort of coming full circle now is exactly what Rob’s saying, and I think you’d be the first to see that in yourself as well, that that was a big turning point, taking off that attitude around what it was and shit, I’m a big part of this.
Speaker 1 (00:52:30):
Yeah, it’s more me than anything else and it’s that whole idea of the bigger business gets, it doesn’t get any easier. You get better at dealing with it. You personally develop, the bigger the business grows. It’s not like, oh, you’re going to get to this point and geez, business is going to be so easy. Business gets harder and harder the bigger it gets, but you develop personally and you get better and better at dealing with the hard, and I sort of said earlier, the stuff that used to send me through a loop two years ago doesn’t even touch my radar anymore. And now the things that send me through a loop are a lot bigger, but you get a lot better at dealing with it. And like Rob said, you’ve got to develop yourself personally faster than what the business is developing because you are the bottleneck. And if you don’t develop yourself personally, you won’t develop your business.
Speaker 3 (00:53:17):
Yeah, there’s a development. I think you’re absolutely right. There’s the personal development side and then there’s the sharing of that journey and being vulnerable enough to admit that I don’t have this all together, whether it’s with your team or at home or whoever. It’s with that sense of being comfortable enough in your own skin to lead, regardless of whether it’s perfect, not perfect, there’s going to be the raw you come through no matter what. It’s, whether or not you can be comfortable sharing that. And this is probably the last thing we’ll touch on today, but the other nail I remember from leverage and it’s gone throughout the journey is you getting comfortable with sharing your journey and particularly with Katie and what that meant. When we first did that and you sort of sat down and said, all right, this is because it was frustrating for a while, not feeling like anyone was on the same page as you. Not being able to recognise, look at what I’m going through. I’m doing all of this and who’s with me and where is everyone. But you had to come forward and be comfortable enough to share the fact that it wasn’t all together, that it was difficult, all the things you’re now talking about so well here wasn’t always the way that you could approach it.
Speaker 1 (00:54:23):
No, a hundred percent. And we sort of touch on a little bit of my journey with my wife as well in terms of sharing with her. She’s not involved in the business at all. We tried that six years ago. It wasn’t really her thing. So now she’s sort of kept out of it as such.
Speaker 3 (00:54:41):
She talked to your dad and said, no, I’m not doing this shit.
Speaker 1 (00:54:47):
Yeah, I’m not dealing with him. But it was that whole thing of like, okay, she’s not involved in the business, so I never used to keep her updated on whatever was going on. So even if I was coming home a bit stressed and stuff like that, she’d have no idea why. I’d just be in a feral mood. That’s it. That’s all she would know, whether it was cashflow, whether it was employees, whether it was jobs, not going, it was just me coming home in a feral mood. And that was one of the things we really touched on in leverage was I get frustrated because I’m going to work and I’m working my ass off to try and get us into a better position in life and bits and pieces and why didn’t she get this? Why doesn’t she understand what I’m doing for her and the family and all the rest of it and the sacrifice and blah, blah, blah.
(00:55:32):
And it’s opening up and having that communication with her. I think one of the things that came out of leverage was we try to do a date night once a month. Prior to that, we never did that. So we try and go to dinner and I use that bit of time for us to actually have open conversations without the kids hanging office around business and around life and where we’re at. And she can tell me how she’s feeling and I can tell her how I’m feeling and how the business is going. And those conversations were nonexistent two years ago, three years ago.
Speaker 3 (00:56:03):
That frustration and that emotion, that passion for the business, it’s not always negative if you’re frustrated, sometimes it’s just a sign that you really give a shit and you love your business and that to you, Matt was never a question, but how does that come across and how do you balance that out? I think that’s the challenge that guys have. The guys that love their business have got families. It’s like it’s not a one or the other. And I think being able to navigate through, that’s probably the next phase or you’ve sort of started to do that, Matt, but that’s really the next thing is how do I integrate all this so that it can continue and endure.
Speaker 1 (00:56:37):
And I enjoy business, I enjoy the game of business. It’s something that I really enjoy and it’s having, I guess your partner understand that you might be frustrated, but you enjoy the growth that comes from that frustration. And now look, she still struggles with it sometimes, but she gets what I’m trying to do and I keep her in the loop. What’s going on? We’re employing new people. We’ve got this project going on and I don’t have to involve her in every day to day and every stress and all the rest of it, but I think she appreciates getting a bit more information out of me. She probably still says that I don’t give her enough, but in general, we have a lot better communication around that now as well, which then she understands a lot more of where I’m at and what stage of the journey I’m at and whether I’ve got more time or got less time because we’re developing the business to that next level.
Speaker 2 (00:57:29):
And I think that’s important because as you said, sometimes you’re growing and sometimes you’re in good spots, sticking spots, it gets harder, it gets a bit easier, and you’re going through various different phases you go. But what you’re saying here is just having good strong open lines of communication and it’s important just to talk through these things to strengthen the relationship and have a better family life whilst you’re growing your business so you don’t have to have one or the other.
Speaker 1 (00:57:55):
Yeah, a hundred percent. I think that leads to a lot of other issues if you don’t have that communication and they don’t understand what’s going on. So I think it’s very important.
Speaker 2 (00:58:07):
Before we round out today, Matt, tell us a bit about what the business looks like in its current form at the moment.
Speaker 1 (00:58:14):
So in its current form, so it’s obviously myself, I’ve got an admin, my old man still does the accounts. I’ve now got a project manager, I’ve got a service and technical manager, so project manager looks after all our projects, service and technical manager looks after all our sort of service work as well as all the technical components in our projects, the automation side of things. And then we currently have eight in the field and we’re looking to employ a couple more at the moment.
Speaker 2 (00:58:43):
So good. You’ve tripled your team over the last couple of years, you and a few guys and eight in the field, eight in your ground crew and a growing operational structure. It’s been so good to watch your business evolve and gee, you guys do some epic work in around Melbourne. You do some work on some beautiful homes for some really great businesses and you do some really great work, don’t you?
Speaker 1 (00:59:06):
Yeah, no, it’s good. It’s a good field to be in. It can be frustrating at times, but no, in general it’s good. And I enjoy the challenge of what all those bigger homes throw at us.
Speaker 2 (00:59:18):
Now I know that you love the outdoors, you love getting outdoors with your family and everything. What is that structure going to enable for you? I know you’re going on a bit of a caravan trek coming up. Tell us a bit about what this structure is going to enable you to do shortly with your family.
Speaker 1 (00:59:36):
So we’re taking off all of August, so first time ever in, what are we, 13 years of business. I’m going to take an entire month off and we’re going up to Cape York with a family and some family friends, et cetera, taking the caravan up and we’ll do a few of the iconic four-wheel drive tracks and fishing and explore at the top end there. So I guess having this structure, I mean look, I’m still going to have to do a little bit of work here and there while we’re away, but in general, I know the business is in good hands between my service manager and my project manager. They can look after all the day to day, they can deal with the phone calls, they can deal with organising the guys, getting the projects done, hitting the milestones that need to be hit and it all sort of grow from there. So yeah, I’m hoping by the time I go away until I have an estimator in place, which will obviously take a lot of that off my plate while I’m away as well, which will be awesome, but it gives you that freedom. Like I say, it’s the first time in 13 years I’m going to take four weeks off.
Speaker 2 (01:00:33):
And you just couldn’t do that three years ago when it was you running around doing everything with a couple of blokes, Hey.
Speaker 1 (01:00:39):
Nah, I’d go on a holiday and my phone would ring 10 times a day, 20 times a day and I’d have to do emails and bits and pieces. And so now having this structure, as you build it out more and more, the more you see that you can dive headfirst into business, but you can also have those times where if you want you can pull back out and have a bit of time and freedom to go do some things that you’d like to do.
Speaker 3 (01:01:02):
Yeah, it’s awesome to see, mate, the amount of work that you’ve done to get to that point. It’s a real milestone I think for the business to be able to get there. And I hope you guys, when you do that trip and you have a great time with Katie and the kids and the boys, you come back though and not so much celebrate the fact that you went on a holiday, but just what the business is able to stand on its own for two feet and do when you get back and celebrate it with your team as well because it’s been a hell of a journey. We’ve loved coaching you and walking through this with you and seeing the growth that you’ve had. It’s been huge. And looking back today even I look back and go, shit, it’s been a hell of a journey. So mate, really well done. Thanks for coming in today and talking to us so openly and honestly. And yeah, look forward to seeing what the next chapters hold. It’s going to be awesome.
Speaker 1 (01:01:47):
It should be fun guys. Appreciate it. Thanks for having me on. Yeah, we’ll see where this journey goes. We’ve still got a long way to go yet.
Speaker 2 (01:01:55):
Thanks mate. We really appreciate it. You’ve done an epic job and if you’re in that position where Matt’s story resonated with you, maybe you’re at where Matt was and you’re at that around that million dollar mark and you’re frustrated and you’re just not getting ahead, that you have the capability and the desire to want to do it. If that’s you in that position or one of your mates is in that position, then jump across to strategysession.com.au book a discovery call. We’ll have a good honest chat around where you’re at and where you’re trying to go and let’s see if we can help you achieve some amazing things just like Matt has. Thanks again mate. You’ve done an epic job. We’re really proud of you and thanks for sharing your journey today.
Speaker 1 (01:02:33):
All good guys. Thank you.